Going broke? An old way to conserve....

[Buck]

This bill needs our support. FINALLY the congress sees the bicycles as
a real "VEHICLE" for personal transportation!!

http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/z?c110:hc305:

Bicycles work well to save gas, groceries and all other local
utility uses even if you live in the country.

Plus a little time on a bike will make a healther you!! ;D

[MooseToo]

"this bill deserves our support" ? - baloney - this bill should not even exist - fedgov should not spend one dollar on a plan to "provide support", etc -
increased bike ridership is an excellent idea - fedgov involvement should be nothing more than informational promotion -

[Buck]

"this bill deserves our support" ? - baloney - this bill should not even exist - fedgov should not spend one dollar on a plan to "provide support", etc -
increased bike ridership is an excellent idea - fedgov involvement should be nothing more than informational promotion -

I take you haven't been on a bicycle lately. If you have then you
know first hand about all the idiot drivers that believe that bicycles
are for kids and should stay on the sidewalks.

Either that or this is another one of your snotty post just to spoil
the thread.

[MooseToo]

I take you haven't been on a bicycle lately. If you have then you
know first hand about all the idiot drivers that believe that bicycles
are for kids and should stay on the sidewalks.

Either that or this is another one of your snotty post just to spoil
the thread.

this thread needed no help from me to spoil - as soon as nanny govt was assigned to carry the ball the concept attained the "same old crapola" status -

[Southern_Gent]

I take you haven't been on a bicycle lately. If you have then you
know first hand about all the idiot drivers that believe that bicycles
are for kids and should stay on the sidewalks.

Either that or this is another one of your snotty post just to spoil
the thread.


I dare say that there's a fair number of idiots on bicycles, too. *Indeed, in my area, I often see people riding side by side in the bike lane, when the lane is only meant for single file. *Other times, I've seen bicyclists riding together in large groups, up to four abreast, blocking traffic for miles as they span the breadth of one lane on a two-lane road. *Then there's multiple traffic infractions, as bicyclists fail to act like vehicles of the road, while expecting to receive all the rights of one. *

Fortunately, not all bicyclists are like those examples above. *Also, while I've never been fond of the traditional form of the bicycle, I've recently had the opportunity to ride a recumbant trike. *This one had the two wheels in front, a reclined seat, multiple gears, and the owner had even added an electric motor with solar recharge ability. *

[Steve_L]

Where in Article 1 of my constitution does it say the congress can write such a law?

Why would I advocate an unconstitutional law?

[Buck]

I dare say that there's a fair number of idiots on bicycles, too. *Indeed, in my area, I often see people riding side by side in the bike lane, when the lane is only meant for single file. *Other times, I've seen bicyclists riding together in large groups, up to four abreast, blocking traffic for miles as they span the breadth of one lane on a two-lane road. *Then there's multiple traffic infractions, as bicyclists fail to act like vehicles of the road, while expecting to receive all the rights of one. *

Fortunately, not all bicyclists are like those examples above. *Also, while I've never been fond of the traditional form of the bicycle, I've recently had the opportunity to ride a recumbant trike. *This one had the two wheels in front, a reclined seat, multiple gears, and the owner had even added an electric motor with solar recharge ability. *

Yes, all to many "recreational" riders just pedal aimlessly never
thinking about the world around them. They give serious commuter
and utility riders a bad rap with the public. In time the police will
bust a few for running stop signs or lane usage and they will either
quit riding (good!) or serious up (better!)about riding within the rules
of the road

I agree about recumbents. I own a semi-recumbent (not so low)
Worksman PAV that is my "truck" in town since I equipped it with
a good sized trunk in place of the basket.

http://www.worksman.com/pav.html

[rAcErRicK]

Steve L, assuming your's is the same as mine, they have been commissioned to "regulate interstate commerse", no more, no less. WE THE SHEEPLE have allowed them to regulate when and where we go to the bathroom, and what you wear while we drive our vehicle's. If they can tell us we have to wear a seatbelt, they can also tell us we must also wear pink boxer shorts while doing so. And before anyone jumps me reguarding seatbelts, I am in strong support of same, and had them in my 1949 Ford, long before they were even mentioned. The problem I have with them is being told I MUST wear it, by the same (should i use the word?) people that are elected (and SWORN) to uphold the same constitution they are voilating by telling me what to wear ANYWHERE, much less in my vehicle ! Guess they will now require them on the bicycles, right ? How bout the shorts ? Will the skid marks be allowed, and if so, how many ? And will it be state, or local inspectors ?

[Buck]

Proof that cycling really can work......

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5rwwxrWHBB8&NR=1

[Steve_L]

I biked everywhere when I was a college freshman. After being run off the road several times and actually hit once, even though I was in a bike lane, it dawned on me that drivers:
Don't care if they hit you, other than to the hassel of telling their car insurance company, if even.
Would just as soon kill you as look at you.
If I get crushed to death by an SUV, that it won't matter if I saved a few bucks on gasoline or if I got a degree at all.


If you want to get me back on that bike, we need to pass a law that says that bike riders can carry hand gernades and pistols. Anyone shot or blown up with a hand gernade will be able to bill my insurance for damages. If I shoot someone or blow them up with one of my gernades, it would be considered an "accident" (as much an accident as their hitting me).

I think once bike riders have as much killing power as people in SUVs, (who think bike riders are annoying little bugs) then they would respect them and share the road.

[Buck]

If you watched the youtube link then you should
have noted that the Dutch/Colombians dealt with
the car problem by banning car use at times or
certain places.

You're right tho about idiot drivers. A great many
should not "drive" at all. ::) ::)

[jott]

As long as they are not making laws saying you can’t own a car, I think it is a great idea to encourage the use of bikes and trains. I live in an area now with lots of college kids and most people walk or ride bikes. This is my first living in the city full time place. At first is was hard on me, but now I really enjoy walking to the store to get anything I need, if you are out with friends for dinner and you drink a few to many who cares you only live up the block so you are not driving anyway. A lot can be said for just using a bike, where it is possible. The girl that lives next door has a moped and a car she only uses the car once every other week. I have to use my car almost everyday to get to work but that’s it. Everything else I walk too. Now were I work is a completely different story, there it is sprawl at some of its worst. Office buildings are spread out all over the place and everywhere else is parking lot. All around that area is new housing developments full of houses that all look the same. Now you would think that the people that live in a house less then a mile from the office could walk to work, but not here everything is connected by multi lane roads that you could never cross safely on foot or bike, and if you tried every insertion has a sign saying you can’t cross there so you would be breaking the law. They just started a new huge shopping center and I looked at the plans all parking lots and multi lane roads that will be one big traffic mess. I will go to the stores to get something I need if I know they have it but I will never go there to do some shopping and look around. For the most part you will have to find a parking spot then to go to the next store you will have to get in your car and wait at a traffic light and take 10 min to get to another store and find another parking spot and they are within site of each other. If that is not just stupid I don’t know what is. My commute to work takes me about 10 min to get within ½ mile from my office and then it takes 10-15 min to get there. I’m going to say the US transportation system has a lot to be desired.

[Buck]

A good place to learn , and comment, on all
things bicycle , bike commuting, living car
free or car lite, utility use of the bicycle is...

www.bikeforums.net.

[msta999]

Proof that cycling really can work......

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5rwwxrWHBB8&NR=1


Did you notice, in the video, there were no crouds. Maybe 20 people at most shown at one time. Get rid of the cars and you get rid of a lot of people. The People go somewhere else.

[CountryKitty]

Bikes are a great way to get around---the Mennonites and Amish around here do it all the time, and quite a few also use roller blades.

I'm torn between wanting to say that the government ought not be using taxpayer dollars to teach people what ought to be common sense...and the realization that way too many people just aren't learning to use their heads at home as kids any more.

[MooseToo]

i really don't think people would get upset if the fedgov limited its involvement to education - public service announcements and/or promotion - unfortunatley we know that their involvement will not end here - it never does -

[DavidOH]

"this bill deserves our support" ? - baloney - this bill should not even exist *-
MooseToo
Thank you for your voice of common sence.

BTDT
---Rode my bike to work (24.5 miles one way) twice.
Only did it the second time because I forgot how DANGEROUS it was the first time.

Yup, too many idiots on the road.

Buck... that bike forum is in my favorites list.
I have posted there several times.

[HockeyFan]

I don't have a problem with the government encouraging the use of bicycles or anything else, but I do have a problem with them doing much as far as funding.
Let's face it. The government is horribly inefficient with regards to just about anything. It takes them approximately $80,000 to provide a welfare family less than $10,000 of support. That kind of inefficiency isn't where I want funds going when funds are so hard to come by right now.
I'd rather see them encourage the private sector to bring in the alternatives.
I will say that a place where public funds make sense, is that sidewalks are going to need to evolve. The narrow sidewalks in neighborhoods need to change to wide ones that can support two way traffic of bicycles and skaters. In my opinion, there are a lot of people able to bike to and from work, and they should be doing so. This will cut down on pollution, oil consumption, and it will promote good health of the people biking.

[pcrowder]

If you watched the youtube link then you should have noted that the Dutch/Colombians dealt with the car problem by banning car use at times or certain places.


Buck - That's great for young, healthy people. How is an 85 yr old woman supposed to get back and forth to the store? Or a person supposed to get back and forth to the doctor if they're sick? How ya gonna carry groceries home on a bike? I live 36 miles round trip to the closest little store on dirt roads, and it isn't feasible for a large part of the population. And it seems like everytime the gov't is BANNING something, the people that do the "banning" are the ones who always find a way around the ban! >:( Pardon me, but VOLUNTARY is best.

[Buck]

"Buck - That's great for young, healthy people. How is an 85 yr old woman supposed to get back and forth to the store? Or a person supposed to get back and forth to the doctor if they're sick? How ya gonna carry groceries home on a bike?"

ALL of these concerns have been addressed successfully
by millions of people worldwide by all ages of people.

[RangerRick]

Me thinks this dung runnith deep. *But of course if one is hoping to pattern America and Americans in the shadow of China the bike makes perfect sence. *This is just more liberal claptrap pie-in-the-sky fantasy for the foolish. *But gee, "wouldn't it be nice"? * ;D

Rick

[docsoos]

Me thinks this dung runnith deep. *But of course if one is hoping to pattern America and Americans in the shadow of China the bike makes perfect sence. *This is just more liberal claptrap pie-in-the-sky fantasy for the foolish. *But gee, "wouldn't it be nice"? * ;D

Rick

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v481/Pennville_Bill/Other%20Stuff/Clap.gif

DocSoos

[Buck]

Me thinks this dung runnith deep. *But of course if one is hoping to pattern America and Americans in the shadow of China the bike makes perfect sence. *This is just more liberal claptrap pie-in-the-sky fantasy for the foolish. *But gee, "wouldn't it be nice"? * ;D

Rick

In the early part of the 20th century the bicycle was viewed as wonderful
invention. Unlike the horse it needed no food or other maintance but it
was killed by GM to sell cars that were also new at the time.

So take your pick in and "after car" world.....the bike or horse manure.

[chloe3388]

For people that are going to raise their own food a horse provides transportation and fertilizer. Also living very far from town if you stick to the roads it would be a long trip and a horse would be better for cutting through the woods..

So for me it's a horse.

[chrisser]

I'm not going to take either side of the argument as to whether bicycling is a practical idea.

However, if it is a good idea, then it doesn't need Federal government involvement to make it happen.

Perhaps the idea has merit. Maybe it should be discussed in a place like San Diego. Its similar in size and configuration to many cities across the country. It also has a high population density, high average income and good tax base, and very comfortable weather most of the year. Plus, there are plenty of left coasties that will embrace an idea like this without thinking it through, giving plenty of momentum.

If a place like that can make bicycling a viable commuting alternative, then perhaps another cities in that state could look at doing the same thing, perhaps LA. If it works in a couple of places in CA, including major cities, maybe government at the county level should get involved. Maybe its a good enough idea that the state government should get involved. That would be the point where other states could look at CA's success (or lack of it) and decide whether or not they should consider adopting and adapting the same ideas.

But if it hasn't even been proved to be practical in a near-ideal environment at the local level such as desribed above, then why would anyone even consider involving government at any higher of a level? Its just reckless, wasteful, and unecessary. The devil is in the details, and the details are largely unknown until the idea is tried, first on a smaller scale, and then progressively on larger scales.

This is supposed to be the United States of America, not the United State of America. Diversity is a PC term thrown about a lot, but here's an example of real diversity; each state is supposed to be a laboratory of ideas, with the best ideas being self-evidentiary and adopted voluntarily by the other states to suit the unique needs of the people within them.

The federal government is a blunt instrument of forced conformity. In my short life, my experience has been that those who use the Feds as a first resort either have an idea that is so bad that no one would adopt it otherwise, or else they are more interested in controlling others than in solving problems.


A few other thoughts...

My wife and I enjoy riding our bicyles for recreation/exercise. We have a very nice metropark system in Cleveland and the surrounding counties, at least this time of year. There are paved "multipurpose trails" for walking and biking. Generally, they parallel the roads that service the parking lots in the park. What I find interesting is that the bicylists with all the "gear" prefer to ride on the roads, generally being a nuisance to motorized vehicles because the roads are quite narrow with no shoulder. One of the reasons the roads are so narrow is that the limited space is partially taken up by the BIKE PATHS NEXT TO THE ROAD THAT THE BICYCLISTS WON'T USE. Apparently, they'd rather risk becoming a hood ornament than share a path with walker/jogger/runners. This makes no sense to me, but then I drive to work so maybe I just don't get it.


I also am seeing more and more bicyclists on the roads and read about how motorists are supposed to share the roads with them. I think that's true, and try to be courteous. However, I find that a good number of bicyclists seem to think they are exempt from traffic laws. I have yet to see one use a simple hand signal to indicate turning (or stopping). They ignore stop signs and red lights routinely, go around other traffic when it suits them, speed whenever they can and generally make nuisances of themselves when they're in groups. "Sharing the road" is a two-way street and is for the safety of all parties. One would think those who are most vulnerable to instant death in an accident would be the paragons of safe road operation.