Bread Machine anyone??

[Buck]

I'd like to make our own bread to control what's in it
now that DW & I are Type II Diabetic.

That said please share with me your experience and all info
that you might have about using a bread machine and which
machine has worked well for you.

ALL info is welcome! ;D

[Dawgus]

Well...bread making is my wifes department, but I'll go ahead and reply for her, lol.
She had a bread machine for a few years, I believe it was a christmas gift. The thing was loud, annoying, and just took more time to set up, use, and clean, and put away then it was really worth. (was the same thing with a pasta machine)
She now bakes bread from scratch every weekend. We eat bread at dinner,sometimes toast in the morning, and I take a sandwich or 2 in my lunch every day. She makes enough dough by hand for 4 loaves, bakes 2, and freezes the other 2 after the 2nd rise. She just thaws it, let it rise again, and pops it in the oven.
Its something she really enjoys doing more now by hand, plus its one less electric gadget that we really dont need.

[Shamrock1121]

I'd like to make our own bread to control what's in it
now that DW & I are Type II Diabetic.

That said please share with me your experience and all info
that you might have about using a bread machine and which
machine has worked well for you.

ALL info is welcome! ;D

I'm on my second Zojirushi (V-20). I wore the first one out, and if this one died I'd get the next version X-20. I also make ALL our breads/rolls/burger and hot dog buns/English Muffins, etc. using the bread machine.

They also have a smaller version - the Zojirushi Mini, but it only makes a 1-pound loaf. It's not always easy to find 1-pound bread machine recipes. The recipes usually are for 1-1/2- and 2-pound recipes.

The V-20 or the X-20 will make 2+ pounds of dough (or a 5-cup flour capacity). I make the largest amount possible. From a 2+pound amount of dough I can make a 1-pound loaf of bread plus some dinner rolls, or hamburger/hot dog buns, or cinnamon rolls; or 3 small loaves of bread with the entire amount of dough, when I use the dough cycle and bake the bread in the oven.

I've taken and taught bread machine coarses and have used a variety of bread machines over the years, and the Zojirushi wins hands down. It's the machine of choice in the King Arthur (Flour) test kitchens. They use the Zo to make their bread dough because it does a better job than by-hand or using a stand mixer. It's what the machine was designed to do. This is especially true if you are making whole wheat bread. In their (King Arthur) side-by-side tests using the Zo and a stand mixer, the whole wheat bread dough made in the Zo baked into a loaf that was about 1-inch taller than the dough made in a stand mixer. A stand mixer tends to aerate the dough too much.

I mill my own flour from a variety of grains/seeds/beans that I add to bread, and many bread machines companies don't even want you to use home-milled flour in their machines. Many bread machines aren't powerful enough to make 100% whole wheat bread and tell you not to use them for 100% whole wheat bread recipes. I make 100% whole wheat bread dough all the time in the Zo. I have friends who have the original Zo (the S-15 - that only makes 1-pound loaves) and it's been used once or twice a week for over 15 years and they nearly always make 100% whole wheat bread from freshly-milled flour and bake it in the bread machine.

I use the Zo on the dough cycle only and bake the breads in my traditional, convection, or solar oven. I also take the dough out as soon as it has completed the kneading cycle and allow the dough to rise in a dough-rising bucket. I like to be the judge of when the dough has doubled, not some machine on a timer. Dough rises according to the strength of the yeast used, the hydration, and the ambient air temperature and humidity.... NOT a timer. So I basically use the bread machine as a tool for mixing and kneading. I'm kinda a control freak when it comes to bread.

If you get a bread machine, I'd also suggest the book, Bread Machines for Dummies by Glenna Vance and Tom Lacalamita (sorry it has such a personally insulting title, no insult intended, I assure you ::)). This book has excellent instructions and information and I've never had a recipe flop that I've made from this book. I have at least 15 Bread Machine Cookbooks, and this one is my favorite. Check your local library for bread machine cookbooks and possibly some videos on using a bread machine.

You can also use your old/traditional recipes and alter them to make them in a bread machine. I have arthritis in my fingers, carpal tunnel in my wrists, and tennis elbow (professional knitter and crocheter for too many years), so making bread by hand is a chore for me anymore. As long as I don't use much more than the 5-cup flour limit, I can make any type of recipe on the dough cycle - even my old favorite recipes that aren't for a bread machine. I still apply all the bread science I used when I made bread by hand.

But all-in-all, the bread machine is also a very cheap way to bake a loaf and that's how I used my first machine - to keep the heat out of the kitchen in the summer when I baked bread.

I'll address the diabetic issue in another post. I might run out of room in this one.

-Karen

[Shamrock1121]

Now, concerning being diabetics and bread making...

I look at the glycemic impact of bread and have tried to use low-glycemic ingredients when making bread, and ingredients with a lot of fiber that help lower the impact.

Spelt and Kamut, the ancient forms of wheat, have a lower glycemic index number than whole wheat, and I often like to use part spelt or kamut in bread (I mill my own). These flours will not raise your blood glucose as quickly as white and whole wheat flour. Other flours that are lower on the glycemic index include rye, barley and oats. They are good choices for multi-grain breads.

I use agave nectar - a low-glycemic, natural, honey-like sweetener, instead of sugar in bread (not that there's usually very much sugar in bread). It's also allows the bread to brown like sugar does (Splenda, and other chemical sweeteners won't do that), and it also is very beneficial in the fermentation of the dough. I believe using agave nectar in yeast breads also helps the loaf to stay fresher longer and aids in better freezing quality.

I also like to increase the fiber in breads, which also helps to slow the up-take and lowers the glycemic impact. I add multi-grain cereal to many of my breads. The coarsely-ground grain is used as cooked cereal and can be found as 5-grain, 7-grain, 11-grain, etc. The large chunks of grain will aid in slowing the up-take of the carbohydrate-rich bread.

Just be sure to add "chunky" stuff at the end of the kneading cycle. The Zo has an add-in beep, and that's when you add things like raisins or the multi-grain cereal, or other "chunky" stuff. If you add the "chunky"stuff too soon in the kneading, the sharp edges of the multi-grain cereal will cut the gluten strands and you'll end up with a short loaf. If you add raisins early in the mixture, they will be pulvarized by the bread machine.

I always add 2-3 T. flaxmeal to all bread recipes (which increases the fiber) and 1/3-1/2 c. of chia seed gel per loaf of bread. Chia seeds are very high in fiber and nutrition. The gel (a combination of chia seeds and water) also contribute to keeping a loaf of homemade bread fresher longer. My loaves of 100% whole wheat bread are just as soft on day 7 as they are on day 2. We use one 1-pound loaf of bread a week. We consume 4 servings of bread/grains per day - made from whole grains.

Additions of protein and fat, such as enriched breads containing, a small amount of butter, eggs and dairy products will also help slow the up-take of bread. Avoid lean breads like Italian or French breads that that only contain white flour, water, yeast and salt. They will quickly raise your blood sugar levels. Sourdough breads are also suggested for use by diabetics because they are low-glycemic compared to most breads. But making sourdough breads in a bread machine takes some special care and methods.

I also make small loaves in smaller loaf pans (7-1/2x3-1/2-inches - using 10-16 oz. of bread dough - I mesure the dough on a scale). I can easily slice these into very thin slices and they still appear to be a full slice of bread. I can cut 1/2-oz. slices so I can still have 2 slices of bread for a sandwich and it counts as 1-serving of bread (1-oz.). If you make 2-pound size loaves, they are WHOPPERS and a person tends to cut slices that equal 2 and 3 servings (2-3 oz.) of bread. It's difficult to cut large loaves into thin slices. They tend to fall apart.

Contact your health care professional for more information about bread for your personal needs. I'm not a doctor, although I've worked with a health care professional who trains new diabetics and others with blood glucose challenges (Syndrom X, pre-diabetes, insulin resistant, hypoglycemic, etc.) in developing low-glycemic recipes.

We don't have diabetes, but our diet is probably closer to a diabetic-friendly diet than most diabetics follow.

-Karen

[Buck]

Karen, WOW!! Thank's ;D ;D

Do you care to comment on dawgu's post since he seems to
be the other side of the coin for a well rounded opinion?

(NOT picking at dawgus at all here)

[annabella1]

Karen; Where do you get your chia seed? I have been trying to find it at a reasonable cost in a large amount. Can't seem to find it very easily.

[Shamrock1121]

Karen; Where do you get your chia seed? *I have been trying to find it at a reasonable cost in a large amount. Can't seem to find it very easily.

I order from Dancing Algae Company -
www.dancingalgae.com/

I usually get 5-pounds at a time and split it with a friend. A pound is a LOT for occasional use.

I make a pint of the gel at a time using a heaping tablespoon of seeds plus 2-cups of water (give or take - you can make it thick or thin or somewhere inbetween). I use 1/3-1/2 c. of the gel in all bread recipes. The seeds last a long time and are a great emergency storage food.

I'd suggest reading: The Magic of Chia by James F. Scheer.

I consider chia seeds a VERY important food to have in storage. It's more of a SUPER food really.

-Karen

[Shamrock1121]

Karen, WOW!! Thank's *;D ;D

Do you care to comment on dawgu's post since he seems to
be the other side of the coin for a well rounded opinion?

(NOT picking at dawgus at all here)

How about, "different strokes for different folks"! ;) It's not a right or wrong thing, it's a matter of choice based on two different experiences and different needs. Some people like a 5-speed manual transmission, and some people like to drive an automatic.

I must admit, I used a bread machine that belonged to the Extension Foods Agent that was such a filthy, nasty, piece of crap, if it had been the only bread machine I had used, I wouldn't be typing all this information here today because I would have said they aren't worth it.

I've made plenty of large batches of yeast and sourdough bread by hand and have a hand-crank Back to Basics Dough Maker - http://www.epinions.com/reviews/Back_to_Basics_Dough_Maker?_redir_att_abrtd_=1

I can make large amounts of dough in a few minutes of hard work in that, but these are difficult for me to do anymore. Both require a lot of hand/arm/wrist movement that I have a problem doing without a lot of pain the next day. I don't normally need to make large batches of bread anymore, either. I can make 3 small loaves of bread out of one recipe made in the bread machine, and that's 3-weeks worth of bread for us.

Using a bread machine doesn't make you weak or stupid or your bread any less "bread" than bread made by hand. The bread machine is a tool. Ever use a an electric skill saw instead of a hand saw? Ever beat 3 egg whites to a stiff peak by hand with a whisk instead of an electric beater? They all get the job done, but are different methods and tools.

I think it's easy to clean out the pan in the Zo. If you use if for dough only, dump out the dough, remove any remaining dough with a soft rubber or silicon spatula. Let the pan sit while you do any number of other things having to do with the bread dough. Within 20 minutes or so, the tiny amount of remaining dough will have dried. Take a dry rag or a dry paper towel and brush out the dry dough. For some people that's clean enough, but I go ahead and wash it out with a dish rag and hot soapy water, rinse, and dry it. The pan CANNOT be submerged in water.

I occasionally (like once or twice a year) turn the machine up-side-down or on it's side if I do it without hubby's help, without the pan inside, and brush out any flour residue or bits of multi-grain cereal that gets tossed into the bottom of the machine. I clean it with a soft (clean) paint brush I use for that purpose.

-Karen

[Buck]

Please, a good RELIABLE source for the bread(s) ingredients
for all the breads etc.

DW read the posts so far and is interested but questioned
where we can get the ingredients ,in quanity, to make
the bread(s). Sure, we can shop locally or google a source
but ,to be honest, we would feel more comfortable trying
a recommend source from the folks here who "walk the
talk" when it comes to bread making.

Any sources to recommend?

[theresehirko]

Bob has DM2 so we make our own bread every week. Whole grain and cinnamon raisin for the week and challah for Shabbat. I make about 6 loaves of bread each week and I use the bread machine for the mixing and kneading part. I absolutely love my machine and will replace it when it eventually goes. It is about 15 years old and still going strong. I do bake the cinnamon raisin in the machine. We also use the machine for making the dough for buns, pizza dough, etc.

[Pudlmom]

I haven't read all of the replies, so I am sure you got excellent information, but I wanted to add this just in case someone didn't mention it. We have had three bread machines and have been very pleased, but the run of the mill bread machine could not handle whole wheat flour. I'm talking about home-ground flour, not so-called whole wheat flour bought off the shelf. It was just too much for the motor. We bought a Zojirushi for this purpose, which works great. I have carpal tunnel and tendonitis and I almost never knead anything by hand. You can often find bread machines used because a lot of people buy them and then don't use them. There may be other brand machines that can handle it also. Our old bread machine still works fine for white bread after 15 years.

[8kids4me]

Kind of late in the game here, but I wanted to add that after years of using my Bosch and making 6 loaves of bread at a time, 4 times a week, I only have two children at home now and make a loaf a day in my bread machine. I make a whole wheat/flaxseed loaf that is yummy. I bought my machine at Salvation Army for $10. The price has gone up since I got the other two for my older daughters(theirs only cost $5 each). A great bargain, and when it dies I will replace it with another one from Salvation Army. I think people get them as gifts then never use them, mine have all been like new, manuals included. I keep it on the counter, and it gets tons of use. Pizza dough, quick breads, can all be done in it.

ETA: I have Diabetes Type II as well, and the whole wheat/flaxseed bread works for me.