COLD WEATHER WATER STORAGE

[tcat21]

Hi everybody,

I am trying to solve a problem and I hope someone can help me. We have well water and a cistern. The cistern got damaged from tree roots and instead of moving it and all the piping that goes along with it, we put a smaller tank inside the damaged one. That was a little over a year ago and now we feel the need for extra water storage to get us through the "low water" times. I was thinking about a 1500 gallon above ground plastic tank. How do I keep this from freezing in the winter?

[DM]

There's NO way to answer that without knowing where you live, how cold does it get ect...

DM

[Jason]

I have same problem I have a cabin 7500 feet up in colorado temps get down to -10 in winter I had to go down 3feet for my fondation to get past frost level and I only plan on going up there 4 or 5 times a winter that means no power untill I get there so I need a way to melt the water or put my tank 3feet under ground at the tanks highest spot and then insolate the lid of tank

[longshot]

what about those stock tank deicers? can you run one off a solar powered fence charger?

ls

[Quietgentleman]

A circulation pump in the tank is a good way to keep the water from freezing solid. A small town I live close to does that for the towns water tower to keep it from freezing. Oh I live in Iowa so we see a bit of cold in the winter.

QGM

[kawalekm]

Our homestead is at 5000 feet in the Sierra, with winter temperatures that drop down to about 10-15 degrees F. We use steel tanks that hold 5000 gallons each, which if kept full will not freeze. The tanks absorb enough solar heat during the day that their mass keeps the water liquid throughout the night. I just make sure to cover all the valves with stryofoam, and bury them under earth at about the time freezing weather arrives. These tanks have been in place for 20 years without there ever being a problem.

Visit some of your neighbors and see what systems they have. Old timers will be happy to tell you what works and what won't. There's nothing better than a working system in place to let you know what you can do.

[JAK]

It is a bit of a myth that circulating the water is enough to keep it from freezing. Circulating the water helps it from stratifying and freezing from the top down, but it will take energy, and eventually it will still freeze from the outside in, if it is cold enough for long enough. Certainly a larger tank helps, and some insulation helps, but why not underground? I would suggest a combination of oversizing the tank, insulating the top and sides of the tank, and having at least the bottom of the tank 4 feet down or so, and berming over the tank also. I would not want to be circulating the water uneccessarily, even with wind or solar power, since it could always be used for something else. You could do an analysis based on heat transfer and heat capacity and degree days and all that. It's a bit complicated, but not that much more than a house or anything else. The surrounding ground and soil type complicates things a bit, but you can make some fairly conservative assumptions. A tricky consideration might be venting, and keeping that from freezing, and of course your water line also, and keeping that from freezing. Any reason this can be in a basement or root cellar, or at least under a barn or outbuilding? Sounds like a modern variation on a Spring House, which can be used as a refrigerator for food storage also. If there is a natural circulation, like from a Spring, that would be ideal, and it could be closer to the surface, even in winter and in summer. If it requires a well and pump, it might still be built the same way, but could be a good space for your battery bank also, with plastic to keep everything separate of course.

[Jason]

I have a small crawl space aout 4feet tall could I put my plastic water tank in there and be safe from frezzing it would stay a little wormer then out side but I would say only 10 or 15 degrees wormer then out side .. or what if I had a big tank like 300 gallon would that have a little water in it that would not freeze ??

[Rancher]

For 30 years I owned and lived on a ranch in Gunnison County Colorado, before selling and moving to another ranch in Northern Colorado 20 years ago. I don't know where you live but I doubt that you have colder weather than we have in Colorado.
Your best bet is to bury the water tank below frost line. A stock tank heater will add up to significant cost to keep it operating but the earth below frost line takes no cost. Even with a stock tank heater, if you really have cold weather, the tank must be insulated or it will still freeze except for the area around the heater.
Much of my water for our livestock comes from the creeks flowing through our property but I still have to chop ice every day on the creeks. As for the stock tanks with heaters, they have to be kept free of ice with daily checking and maintenance in the winter.
I suggest that you visit any neighboring farms or ranches and notice how those stockmen handle their water situation. Experience is the best teacher.

[Harry_Chickpea]

I spoze in North Alabama it is cool weather water storage compared to Colorado, but I dug out the side of an embankment, leveled the bottom, and stuck an 1100 gal tank in there. Currently, I have it wrapped in black builder's plastic to gain a little heat and add a little insulation, but I'll bag up some dry oak leaves to put around it this spring, then cover the open side and top with a wall and deck. The poly tanks aren't strong enough for direct burial, from what I've been told.