Barter items

[Tuckahoe]

Having barter items for future hard times may be far more valuable than gold. Here are a few low cost items that can be stored to be traded later.
Reading glasses(A buck a pair at dollar tree)
Coffee, Tea
Sugar
Salt
Pepper
Hard candy
Paperback Bibles
Kitchen Matches
Needles and sewing items
Nylon cord
Duct tape
Tobacco
pencils, paper, note pads
Toilet paper
Tooth paste
Soap
alcohol clear and green
Peroxide
Asprin
Baking soda
tooth brushes

[MYellowRose]

* How about liquor?
* Food of just about any kind, especially canned meats.
Socks
Blankets, quilts, comforters, for bedrolls.
Sleeping bags.
Tarps
Tent stakes
Knives, especially like a Bowie knife.
Tools, especially those for gardening.

[wax]

What would you be bartering for?

It would seem to be a simple question but I often wonder if enough people consider it.

I am not trying to pick on you two because the subject is very common but I am not sure that I truly understand what is being discussed when the topic comes up.

A: Do you mean perhaps in a cooperative environment in which the dollar is devalued but still solvent (like the great deppression of the 30's perhaps)?

B: Do you mean for a societal collapse? One in which the dollar no longer has value?

C: Do you simply mean a modern cooperative that replaces the dollar with a local barter system?

[livesalone]

Wax,
I don't know what Tuckahoe meant specifically but I took it to mean (B)a societal collapse. We should all be "co-operating" (bartering) with friends and neighbors now, I know I am. Just this week I traded my neighbor cutting my too-thick-for-my-mower grass for my figs and a friend gave me a huge amount of assorted beads for a couple months of Parrot-sitting! Should we have a major societal breakdown, I know lots of people that will be willing to share tools, labor, etc .because we are already doing it.

[edward_4576]

The question is this, if things are that bad do you want people to know that you have so much stuff that it might make you a target.

Now bartering skills is different, A strong back or skills with animals or farming would be valuable. Hunting and trapping skills would be useful, especially if you can cure hides.

If in a communal environment wouldn't you be expected to share with everyone?

Barter goods for me would be items to get you to your hunker down location or get you supplies to help you get there. In the beginning of any type of SHTF scenario money would still be usable though highly inflated.

Then you have the issue of being able to judge who to barter with, how trustworthy are they? Do you only barter with people you really know?

I remember stories of peddlers carrying around small items for trade and barter and early in the last century traveling salesmen would often times carry small trinkets to offer people that allowed them to spend the night or give them a meal.

[wax]

Good post livesalone, yes in todays world the "barter" system makes a great deal of sense.

Rural systems have never really lost the art of bartering because resouces (and sometimes more importantly knowledge) is easily traded in a localized system.

I do it often intuitively; my son needed a place to keep his horse and an associate owns horses... he does not however own (or know how to use) a welder.
Once in a while I spend a few hours of my weekend making mends and my son only needs to supply about a quarter of his horses oats... the rest is simply written off.

Having those relationships now will be worth much more than money post SHTF.

Edward- In the beginning of any type of SHTF scenario money would still be usable though highly inflated.

Wax- This is extremely unlikely in the post gold standard world. The money we have in our pockets is worth what we think it is worth because "we" (the US government) says it is worth that much.
The moment the US government becomes insolvent (or is assumed will not recover to secure the debt the money represents) the cash we possess will revert to exactly what it is; a pile of paper.

We have many examples of this occuring but the best is the Confederate currency.
At 9am people had hundreds of thousands of dollars, by noon they had nothing!
There simply would be no time for inflation.
Banks will go from possessing tens of millions of dollars to having nothing.

But there are other issues concerning possession of wealth in a failed economy.

After SHTF:
Gold is gold is gold... is gold.
It was traded before written history and it will be traded after there are none left who can write history.
But worth in a collapsed society is another issue.

After the fall of Rome, a senator who I can no longer name from memory paid for his passage to the Byzantine boundaries (a remnant of the Roman Empire which survived) with 200 thousand Gold Aureus.
He secured his safety, but it cost him more than a large fleet of warships would have days before.

Of course... how much is safety worth in such a situation?

[wax]

Having said all of that, the question, "what would have worth after SHTF?"

Without a doubt the answer is knowledge.

Water
Food
Shelter
Defense

How to obtain it, how to process it, and how to use it to your advantage while denying it to your potential enemies.

Water is quite easy once you know what it is, where it comes from, and what the limitations are concerning it.

Likewise food will not be the issue most believe it would be.
Well perhaps that isn't worded correctly.
Literally millions will starve...
But securing it, processing it, and using it can be easily learned.

Shelter will be a "breeze".
Four men, properly armed and motivated, can secure and hold a typical grocery store like "Cub's Foods" will relative ease.
Just spend as few moments looking at these buildings from the perspective of defense, they are designed to be secure.

Likewise, local jails, government centers, libraries, hospitals, schools will be utilized by various groups of dtermined individuals for shelter.

So really that leaves us with defense... and any good defense involves a good offense.

There is information out there and I will not give any useful information in a public forum, but knowledge concerning defense will be worth much more than gold... or as exampled above: 200 thousand pieces of gold.

[livesalone]

Wax- Well, that was my point really. Relationships with neighbors, etc. may be crucial. I doubt that I will have time, money, or a place to run to when TSHTF so all I will be able to do is support and get support from people who live close to me. I imagine that with the various tools/ skills/ produce/weapons, etc. that we have in the area we should be able to divide up our resources to help each other (each according to their ability) and should be better off than many who will run to a "secure" location and there try to do everything necessary with only a couple/few people to cover every need. How long (and how well) can 2-3 adults guard their property, gather food, tend a garden, take care of medical emergencies, care for stressed children or elders, etc. 24/7 until they are just overwhelmed? It seems to me to just be too difficult a thing for a very small group of people to do for very long. *

[wax]

livesalone- It seems to me to just be too difficult a thing for a very small group of people to do for very long.

Wax- Not at all... in fact get rid the defeatist attitude ASAP!
You are a creature that has... well... a proven track record to say the least!

You are here, with 9 posts, which gives you a leg up over 99.99% of anyone else out there!

2-3 adults can... well... they can change the world they know very quickly!

Two or three adults decided that it was time to stop paying the Kings taxes a long time ago. They convinced a number of others to join in.
One adult can be a "shit-storm" in any society - but two or three?

Your ideas are solid, your thoughts are cohesive, your future is thus secured!
But don't under-estimate what you can and can not do.
And don't limit yourself to an absolute worst or absolute best scenerio.

Nothing you read here; nothing written by me and nothing written by someone else; should ever limit your own preparedness in any way.

If all you ever do is prepare for a local emergency then you have passed beyond simple citizenry (the sheep) and located yourself in an arena of activity which most sadly never enter.

You mention time, money, without giving yourself credit for what you concede is important.

Baby-steps.

The most "secure" location is the one I am currently in.
It is a state of mind and actions born of conviction, not resources that determines that.

[JAK]

I think what makes a good barter item depends on the circumstances. Sometimes it needs to be more easily transportable and transferable. Sometimes it is more important that it is functional, like materials for food, clothing or construction. If you have a useful trade, like a metalworker, or a weaver, or a boatbuilder, or a nurse or a doctor, then it would make sense to have extra materials available that would allow you to practice your trade. The other consideration is the cost and availability of such materials before and after. Somethings might already be just as expensive now, perhaps more expensive now, perhaps because they are attractive but not really all that essential. *Other things, such a firewood, might not demand as high of a price, even as they become more scarce, simply because they might be relatively easy to loot or poach, from someplace else that is. I can see textiles being pretty useful for barter, but not right way, only after a time. Other items might be immediately very useful for barter, but not so much later on, such as bottled water. The bottles themselves might be worth more over time tough. Safe water could also get more and more expensive though, depending on where you live. Effective trade and barter depends on security and trust however, but can also be a means of establishing and maintaining security and trust. Who you trade with, and who you do not, and the availability and use of information and force to be able to make your own best choices is always critically important. The best survivalists might not always be the best traders and the reverse also, so things are likely to be very dynamic for awhile. The other part of the equation is what sort of items are you willing to accept in exchange for something else you might need or eventually run out of. Perhaps this is less important than who you do business with. The biggest problem with all of this is timing. Most prophesies eventually come true. The only real social sin is bad timing.

[desdawg]

I would think the main item to be bartered would be your skills and time. Self sufficent as we would like to be everyone is not necessarily good at doing everything.

[RangerRick]

In a world that probably won't include electricy hand tools of any type will be indespensable and then of course the means to keep what's yours.

Ranger Rick

[BadKarma]

This is a great idea. *In our worst case scenario, I wouldn't think that your typical money would not have as much clout as useful bartering items. *I think that maybe some of our survival knowledge made into some books/pamplets, etc. would probably be good bartering items. *You would be surprised at how many people are clueless when it comes to doing things yourself. *If it doesn't come from the store and you can microwave it, most people have no idea of what to do.

[Cutter]

While shopping one day I found Bumble Bee wild caught Sockeye salmon for 50c a can. This usually sells for about $4 a can. I bought all they had,30 cans. I don't eat much canned salmon but if worse comes to worse I'll use it for barter. It has a 10 year life span. I'll barter for anything I'll need, ammo, seeds, anything.