Lets get personal.

[Steve_L]

I really want to see your budgets here. How much do you make and what you spend it on.

That's taboo and rude to ask, I know... but I want to see how it is done.

My mother was frugal, but I'm less so. Even so, we didn't live on a homestead.

I wish Backwoods home magazine would do a story with some kind of anonymous survey on this.

[Anon001]

I don't know how many people you're going to get answer this. I won't give out my budget or income. I will say that my homestead is self-sufficient. I just haven't been able to produce my own propane yet. I only spend about $200 per month. That includes auto insurance, landline with toll free number plus DSL. It also includes my cell phone bill. I spend an average of about $20.00 per month in groceries. This is just my personal expenses.

For the homestead there is minimal feed expense. I have plenty hay and pasture ground. I am 100% off grid with a solar pv system. I rarely buy garden seed, because I save most of my seed from year to year or trade seed varieties with others. Water is free here. I have the garden below a dam so that my water to the garden is gravity and free. I use rainwater at the house.

My farm brings in enough to pay the taxes and insurance plus. Taxes on this particular 160 acres with my cabin are only $500 per year. This is the first year it went over $500 ($516) but I won the appeal so it will probably drop back down to abotu $480. My insurance on the farms are covered under an umbrella plan so it is hard to say which farm costs how much. I was running 80 cow/calf pairs. I cut back to come up with $18K to $20K in new fences and pasture revitalization. By the end of this year I'm hoping to be back up to 50 pair and back to 80 pair by the end of 2010. It is all layed out in my short and long term budget.

The operation is debt free. The last calves I sold were in January and all of them brought between $1.04 and $1.11 per pound. I can't remember without looking at my paper work, but I think they were around 6 weights.... um (6 weights would be 600 poounders)... I can't remember for sure. Do the math.... I do manage to come up with a lot of deductible expenses. I have to pay some taxes and some years I actually have to spend a lot at the end of the year just to lower my income taxes..... Usually some type of capital investment.... such as equipment.

Anything else you want to know? Without telling you my actual income or showing you my budget (which I WILL NOT do) you can guess what it looks like. Yes, I am accumulating more than I spend. You can tell just by the few figures I've given you.

I think anyone would be crazy to actually list their personal budget for you or anyone else in such a public place as this forum... so, I hope this is something for you to go on.

I AM proof that a homestead can pay for itself and be very profitable if common sense is used which I find a most people don't have.... and a few homesteaders as well.. but most homesteaders do learn common sense if they didn't have it starting out.

Also..one more note. I have not worked away from home since March 2007. ALL my income is derived from home either through the homestead and farm and/or the internet.

Good luck.....Paul

[Cil]

Paul's right. Not a lot of people are going to be answering your questions. No offense, but it's not of your business.

[Steve_L]

Paul's right. Not a lot of people are going to be answering your questions. No offense, but it's not of your business.

yeah, I know. I'm prying, but dying to know.

[Anon001]

I think I gave you enough to go on. Anyone with any sense can do it if they have the desire to learn and if they work hard enough in the early years. I don't work too hard these days. I have things running fairly smoth. Since the farms are debt free and I have no bills to speak of, I can occasionally afford to hire help when I have to have it. I usually don't but once in a blue moon.

Other than giving you my budget, I would gladly answer what questions I can and help you or anyone else in anyway possible.....

[Anon001]

Hey... I think I just had a good idea.

Rather than trying to get others to divulge their budgets... why don't you tell us what we need to know to help evaluate your plans?

Tell us how much you have to spend for a downpayment. What is your net each month or year? Are you debt free? If not how long until you are?

Also, what are your long term goals? Are you wanting complete self-sufficiency? Or are you just wanting to raise the kids in the country? Are you wanting to eliminate a grocery bill and utilities or just help to supplement and lower those bills? Are you wanting to contiue working away from home? Or will you both stay home and work the homestead or work from the homestead?

What is your level of knowledge with cows, chickens, goats, rabbits, dogs, cats.... Do you know how to use a hammer? How are your construction skills? How large is your family? Do all the kids have to have separate rooms? How small a house or cabin are you wanting?

Are you willing to live in a tent for a few months or an inexpensive older RV while you scavenge materials or buy cheap and build your own place?

Do you know how to build fence, cut firewood, and load a stove? Do you know how to can your own raised foods? Do you kids hurl if they see manure or step in it?

Most of all.... is this a family enterprise or is it your dream and you will be doing all the work while trying to also hold down a 40hour per week job 40 miles away?

But, let's start with your balance sheet and many of us can tell you what you can buy in our prospective areas. If you show me your financials, I can tell you to the acre what you can buy in this area and what type and size of house it would include or how many acres it will buy you without a house. I can also tell you what the banks and the land bank will do for you in this area on terms.

Let us know and we will certainly help you and then we can give you a budget to show you what you can do.

Good luck,
Paul

[anna]

We spend less than our income on a regular basis. That is accomplished through careful budgeting. When necessary we slash spending to be sure we have enough to cover big ticket items. Regular savings is part of our budget. A savings account makes the difference between a financial disaster or a painful expense.

[flatwater]

I figured it out one day. I make money and the Government takes it away. I always figured your allowed to make just enough to keep you in dept.

[leera]

PaulNKS I wish I were where you are now.....

We're still a few months away from looking to purchase land or a house......but we're getting there.It's been a long road with a lot of potholes and roadblocks,but the path is finally almost clear.....

I learned a while ago,the less stuff you need,the less money you need to take care of your stuff......

I agree though,before prying and asking for such personal info,the person wanting to know should explain why and what for,and if they are asking,then they should divulge too..... :)

1) spend less than you earn
2)need less stuff,simplify your life and needs
3) make wise choices to stay out of debt

It takes practice to learn to NOT be like everyone else and spend,spend,spend and run up debt and live on credit,but it can be done,and once you're used to doing it,you'll never want to go back........

[Anon001]

Leera,
If I can do it anyone can. *Someone out of debt paying cash will accumulate MORE over time than the same person borrowing. *There is more money because of all that you are not paying for interest each month and because of the fact that you aren't paying more for the house, land, vehicle, tv, etc by paying interest.

My point and one I hope Steve, you, and others consider is that a homestead can be profitable and can also earn you a decent enough living to work from home. *But you have to make the land pay for itself. *That is the key to self-reliant living and one I like to get across to anyone wanting to homestead.

Also, there is nothing wrong with plopping down cash for a smaller starter homestead, making improvements, selling with a profit and "upgrading" to your dream homestead.

Paul

P.S. Leera, Steve and others... when you do start with a homestead that is smaller than your goal, just have a long term goal and don't lose sight of it. Always be working toward that long term goal through various short term goals or you will get in a rut and not progress.

[Buck]

Paul's right. Not a lot of people are going to be answering your questions. No offense, but it's not of your business.

The best answer to this question......no matter your income.....is......

"To spend less than you earn and save/invest the difference"

This is the mantra of those that are rich but don't show it, those that have
lived through hard times, and those who have learned the simple lesson of
"Enough".

The single biggiest failing that gets more people into trouble when it
comes to money is that they "live up to what they earn" everytime
more money is available, i.e. pay raise, sell something, inherit money etc.
These same people would have been much wiser to live at the level they
were and saved or invested the sudden windfall. But no...they foolishly
start to spend it. :-/

[Michael32170]

The best answer to this question......no matter your income.....is......

"To spend less than you earn and save/invest the difference"

This is the mantra of those that are rich but don't show it, those that have
lived through hard times, and those who have learned the simple lesson of
"Enough".

The single biggiest failing that gets more people into trouble when it
comes to money is that they "live up to what they earn" everytime
more money is available, i.e. pay raise, sell something, inherit money etc.
These same people would have been much wiser to live at the level they
were and saved or invested the sudden windfall. But no...they foolishly
start to spend it. *:-/


Exactly......99.8%

[TNDadx4]

Awesome answers!

+1 for Paul. I hope...or should I say plan to be as self-sufficient as you are. That's a high (and enviable) mark, but with some planning, Lord willing and we'll be there.

[jonvee]

Hi Steve,

This is a tough question even without the prying issue, mainly 'cause everyone here is in a different part of the country with different kinds of expenses at different rates. We are also at different stages in our quest for self-sufficiency. So, if people were to open up about their budgeting the answers may not be that relivant to your situation.

As an example - What I spend on water versus what someone else spends wont help you at all if we're indifferent parts of the country. Also, if someone is on a well and I'm not then the issue becomes even more irrelevent. What's important is what YOU are spending on water and finding ways to reduce water useage, find alternate sources of water and ultimately lowering you're water bill or doing away with it all together.

If budgeting and reining in your expenses or being more frugal is your goal then the folks here can give you lots of suggestions, but I think we need a bit more information about what you're trying to accomplish.

Anyway, I think I read your question a little differently than others. I thought you were looking for some "how-tos" and seeing how other people do it would be a good visual. If that's the case I get it. I like to see how other people are doing things to figure out how I can apply it to my situation, but I think you've hit a wall. And - I'm not sharing either :-/ Sorry.

We're more than willing to help - just need a bit more dialog.

[Anon001]

Jonvee,

I say this with respect. But, Steve specifically asked what our budgets are and he asked how much we make and what we spend it on. That is nothing like asking "how" we do something. Other than that, I did like your answer. For example, my water costs nothing except $12.00 in chlorine once a year or so.

Paul

[Kyhome]

Water!! At our last place we only had a cistern for catching rainfall and had to have it hauled in on a regular basis, with two kids a wife and all the kids friends over every day the last year we were there averaged $33.00 per week. and that was a deal with the water man as we were his number 2 largest user. most folks were paying him $37.00 to $40.00 per load. Our cistern was a little over 3,000 gallons and is got went through pretty dang fast. Not to mention the issues with it being 25 feet below the house down hill and 40 foot away. many issues with keeping that poor setup a going and I still try not thinking about the winter time issues had it.

[Steve_L]

These are good answers. Thanks all. I know it was a prying and personal question, but the way my plans are, when I move, I won't have much money. I wasn't sure if I was being reasonable or if I was giving in to wishful thinking.

I look at the farms around here (Seattle), and they cost a million bucks, and land runs pretty high. I kinda thought maybe you had to be a millionaire or inherit bigtime or something to live on a home stead.

[Deberosa]

These are good answers. Thanks all. I know it was a prying and personal question, but the way my plans are, when I move, I won't have much money. I wasn't sure if I was being reasonable or if I was giving in to wishful thinking.

I look at the farms around here (Seattle), and they cost a million bucks, and land runs pretty high. I kinda thought maybe you had to be a millionaire or inherit bigtime or something to live on a home stead. *
I have a very nice homestead for sale across the sound from Seattle that is alot less than a million bucks! And it's for sale! ;-) (taking backup offers just in case!)

[leera]

PaulNKS---

We are nearly there,we are going to have to get a mortgage,no other way around that,as I need to stay where my income is.

We've gone from being nearly 40K in debt to having no major bills and living on a cash only basis.A few years ago we were considering bankruptcy,but having the strong morals that I do,we refused to give up.

We ran up all that debt,why should we shove the problem over to someone else,someone who didn't go out and spend all that? We should we not take responsibility for our own actions? SO we did.....

I keep a cut out of my dream home on the bulletin board above my computer so I never lose sight of what I want.What I want is a house on 20 acres with an orchard,garden,and pastures.....what we're going to actually end up with,who knows.

It may be that we have to settle for something else that we can sell for a profit later,I don't know,we will have to wait and see.

But what we have done in mean time is learn and practice.....

I have learned how to do a lot of repairs and things myself,from basic construction to plumbing and electrical.I have learned to can and preserve food,also learned to dehydrate food,make jerky,etc.....

I have always known how to sew,well at least since about age 7,and have learned to sew with a treadle,so with or without power I can fix our clothes and make quilts,bedding,etc...

I've learned gardening,at least the best I can do living where we do now,and if I can get food to grow here,in a trailer park,in plastic planters,then I can get food to grow just about anywhere.(BWH printed a letter I wrote showing pictures of my container gardening efforts a few years ago)

I've also learned that you don't really need a clothes dryer,or cable TV,or a lot things that most yuppies have.....

We are going to buy a house so that we can get out of this stupid park,and get some real space,but we may have to settle for a house in town for the time being.....I have my eyes on a little place,but it'll probably be sold by the time we get the financing straightened around.........

[Anon001]

Leera,
Look at ground with no house. You can easily scavenge up materials to buildit. I built mine on less than $5,000. If you want more details, PM me.

[reedb66]

We are on our 3rd homestead if you want to call this one that,we live on the edge of a small town and have 3 acres.The last place was in nw wisconsin in the middle of national forest land (it was only 3 acres too) but with the thousands of federal land all around us we were pretty much alone all the time,only 4 other homesteads on the road we lived on and they were scattered good.The town we live in now has less than 300 people in it and we got lucky as they all have been very good to us,very like minded and close knit your instantly family( get this the mayor came to visit and bring a community gift box the first day we got here!!)we used to do everything for cash only as the banks would not loan to us in wisc ,we had no credit rating.When we moved here we found a bank that is eager to work with us so even though it went against what we had been doing for years we have a mortgage and now a small business loan but that is as far as that is going .I should be able (god willing )to pay off the business next year and the house in 2 more years .Our house and land together up north cost us 5,000 to aquire and build we sold for 17,000 to a friend that really wanted it.My house here cost 30,000 here,we have1 of the nicest houses here.there are several under 10,000 and some under 5,000 in the area and they are structurly sound.Just need paint or cleanup .we almost bought 1 this spring 10 acres with a morton 50 by 100 shed and a 5 bedroom ranch style house and some smaller out buildins that I could buy for 35,000 but we just got the business and I dont want to be that far in the hole.now i will give you my expenses

house mortgage 30,000 payment 225.00 per mo
business 15,000 payment 301.00 per mo
all insurances 2000 per year with my wifes 2000 windstar van and the business ins the most expensive costs .
water sewer and trash collection about 80 dollars per mo and I have a dumpster with few limitations on what can go in it.

internet 75.00 per mo
elec 120 per mo most of the year summer my worst bill was 225 when my mother inlaw was here and the house had to be kept at 65 degrees and it was about 95 outside ( we have central air)normaly we keep the house at 68 to 70 all year round.

propane heat ,we go thru 1000 gallons a year ,this year we will finally be wood heat and I can get my wood from the amish at 10 dollars a truck load of slab wood,,,beats the heck out of propane at 2.40 a gallon all winter this year!!!


Those for the most part are my expenses .With my business I work 1 to 3 days a week and it more than pays all the bills at 1 day a week.We are doing well enough to open a second one which will mean I will go back to 6 days a week but that is great cause I will pay off everything way faster and even though I like my banker I dont love him ;D I guess my whole point is we could have kept going where we were and been ok ,But i want more from life and I dont mean new cars I mean security and making my own living and being with my family more.

Seems to me that people get locked into this dad and mom work and the kids get shoved into school and you struggle a long needing permission from work and school to take a day to be a family (to that I say BULL@@@T) this is what the govt wants Think about it ,mom and dad get jobs govt takes taxes ,kids go to school 8 or more hours a day till they graduate ,get to work pay taxes and the story goes .... till someone strays from the flock and homeschools there kids and lives self sufficently and teaches their kids this OMG.Maybe you need to look at other parts of the country and other forms of employment to achieve your dreams .We moved away from family and at first they were upset but the phone and email works both ways and now some of my family lives here to and are glad they moved.They work less ,spend more time with their families and since its cheaper to live here you save money easier.
Just my 2.5 cents as some of you know how long it takes me to type(Paul and Grizz ) this took 1 hour and 2 cups of coffee !!!

Sorry for ramblin
Reed

[leera]

I have thought about going that route,but still up in the air about it.

We don't need anything fancy for a house,as it is just the two of us and a dog and cat.With all the bank forclosure home on the market right now,it might be cheaper just to buy one.

Have a family friend who just bought a forclosure on three acres,haven't got all the details yet,but the location would be good for us,getting me about 10 miles closer to work and church.Having lunch with his wife Monday,will find out more then.He's been buying forclosures,fixing them and reselling....

[MelleeRN]

Won't give you earnings.
However, my husband and I got sick of paying out the nose for rent and living in the city. we got 5 small acres on a private mortgage and camped for the summer to get the cabin ready for move in. during xmas we had not income for 6 month due to injury. between the garden and live stock, we got through with out having to ask anyone for help. The key I have learned is spend less, save more, and reuse everything. now we have 20 acres, still live in small cabin, and saving for the next rainy day.