recommendations please

[tadbitangelny]

Hey everyone. The BF and I are looking to start up our solar system next year. For us newbies what panels, invertor, charge controller etc would you reccomend to new people starting on a budget. This is strictly the start of an experiment in green living for us so we are looking to start real small like something to run the grow lights for our bannana trees. We are also looking into wind turbines as it is always windy here. Please do not overload me with expensive systems. I am looking for information for those of us truely on budgets who would like to start small. I am interested in the opinion of those who already are currently using solar.
Thanks :)

[nadja]

Hello, check out your private messages !

[HuntingHawk]

Hard to help without knowing what your budget is. But solarblvd seems to always have some reasonable size panels on sale. I've bought 80watt for $159 each & 80watt for $129 each plus shipping.

HH

[tadbitangelny]

Thanks Hawk. It's kinda hard to say what our budget will be next year that all depends on the economy. I have asked for a 1,000 watt invertor for Christmas (lol), and have looked at sunelec.com for panels. They have a pretty good selection for the price. The BF and I are looking at just starting our system next year and would eventually like a solar/wind off grid system to at least run our well pump, and keep the freezer cold if anything bad should ever happen. Our end goal is to be off grid in 5 years. We cut our energy consumption down to around 250 kw in the summer and between 500-800 in the Winter. I'm sure if we got creative we could bump those numbers down even farther. Thanks for the heads up on the sight I will check it out tomorrow..thanks for your input.

[12vman]

Hey everyone. The BF and I are looking to start up our solar system next year. For us newbies what panels, invertor, charge controller etc would you reccomend to new people starting on a budget. This is strictly the start of an experiment in green living for us so we are looking to start real small like something to run the grow lights for our bannana trees. We are also looking into wind turbines as it is always windy here. Please do not overload me with expensive systems. I am looking for information for those of us truely on budgets who would like to start small. I am interested in the opinion of those who already are currently using solar.
Thanks :)

Howdy and Welcome!

The first thing you want to do is set a goal. "How much power do I need to operate all of the things I plan to operate?" A close study of all the items you "need" from the start. Be as frugal as you can for your basic creature comforts and start there. A system is designed from the energy that you need, not what you can afford.

Plan for an area to install your array with good sun coverage all day long. Attempt to keep this area as close to your living area as possible. Plan for an area to store your batteries where they can stay warm during the winter. Keep your array close to the ground so you can clean the snow off of it during the winter with ease. Run big gauge wire from the area of your array to the battery area from the start so you don't need to replace it later as you build.

If you're very serious about starting small and building as you can afford, Don't start with no less than 200 watts and buy good stuff. Something worth adding to in the future. Oversize your charge controller so when you do add panels, you don't need to change the controller out for a while. You can always add panels and batteries as needed until you outgrow it.

Be very careful about wind. A good, accurate study can take a year to see if it's really worth the investment. Not too many inland areas are good sites for wind. You can buy a lot of panels for the cost of a properly installed wind genny and you have no moving parts.

Just some brain farts from a worthless nut a little South of you.. ;)

[HuntingHawk]

First thing I suggest would be to look at the required power of your well pump. The voltage, 120 or 240, & both the run amps as well as surge amps.
Now, after that I recommend getting a backup generator that will run it. Even if you end up with both solar & wind in the future there may come a time when you need to replenish batteries with that generator.

You want as many 12VDC electrical stuff as possible to save on stored power. 1amp 120VAC from the batteries draws roughly 12VDC. Takes 10VDc to make 1VAC plus loss in the inverter. You can get 12VDC lights, fans, TV, coffee pot, etc. Check online for RV & travel trailer appliances.

Initially, with batteries & a generator, you can run the generator during the day to run well pump, frig, etc as well as charge the batteries. Then just draw off those batteries at night.

HuntingHawk

[DavidOH]

You first need to evaluate WHAT you want to run on your system.
Determine specifically what lighting, appliances, electronics, you will be using and what the wattage is for each device.
Then carefully determine how long each device is used.

Then you take these totals to determine the total wattage you will need to power your devices.
Something like this calculator might help: http://www.csgnetwork.com/elecenergycalcs.html

[nadja]

I run my entire house on my solar/wind I do NOT use anything 12v other then my house water pump. You simply need to buy things one step at a time if need be until you get to that intersection, where you can cut the teather to the grid. Not as hard as most think. The real trick with solar is learning how to live within it's boundaries, as it will not learn to live with yours. Pay no attention to anyone telling you what to buy and/or how much until you have really done your research. Keep in mind something else also, a lot of appliances that you use without thinking daily , will have to for the most part be discontinued , else it will tax your system way to much. Heating appliances for instance are death to solar.

You have 4 main components in your system, which are solar panels (which are not all created equal), Inverter , same here, charge controller and of course batteries.

When considering your first purchase of solar panels, as with all other equipment, stay away from Chinese junk. Go with Japanese, German or even American. Electronics are the same way, American only for this and batteries, same.

If you intend to go solar, forget the little inverter you asked your mil for for xmas, as it is not for you. Look into Outback, made here in the USA. Quality assured. Same with the charge controller. Best solar panels on the market right now are Shuco's from Germany. 235 watt 24v panels from there are averaging about $585.00 ea. Actually a very good buy. And they come with a 25 year warranty and also Kyrocera's from Japan as well as quite a few others. Batteres, either Trojen's or Surrette (Rolls) are the best for most aplications. Confused yet ? Good, that way you will slow down and do a lot of research before just going out and buying what you think you need. Only to kick yourself later on.

[nadja]

Hard to help without knowing what your budget is. But solarblvd seems to always have some reasonable size panels on sale. I've bought 80watt for $159 each & 80watt for $129 each plus shipping.

HH

HH, how long and how much solar have you got ? How long have you lived with it off grid ? How much practical experience to you have ?

[HuntingHawk]

Laws here don't allow you to live off grid. Also not allowed to live in a place with no hot water heater. Required by law to have a well & septic also
HH

[nadja]

Laws here don't allow you to live off grid. Also not allowed to live in a place with no hot water heater. Required by law to have a well & septic also
HH

If someone came and told me I couldn't live with my solar and wind, I would probably need to borrow a friends back hoe. There is no grid here where I live and most likely won't get here for another 50 or so years. My nearest neighbor is about 2 miles away. No paved roads, and nosy lookie lookers. Bear no and then, badger and wild antelope . My water heater works just fine, and when this one wears out, will replace it with on demand type. Septic, I built over 16 years ago, and never had a bit of a problem with it. :yes4:

[tadbitangelny]

Thanks everyone for all the information, it is so nice to hear from those who are truely using wind/solar. As for wind being viable here it is. We bought a weather station 2 years ago and have been monitoring the wind output here for that long. During the Winter/fall/spring months we are usually around 8-10 miles per hour with days that go into 20-30. We live on a hill at 1,670 feet above sea level and there are quite a few homes here that run wind power. Unfortunately we cannot afford a $50,000 Bergey wind turbine but an airstream or whisper 500 would suit us fine as an accent to solar. We heat our home enitrely with a wood stove so heat/cooking/drying clothes etc is not a problem.
Our goal for the next year is to have something that will keep our energy efficient chest freezer from thawing, run the well pump, and keep our grow lights on as I have bannana trees indoors and grow veggies inside during the winter. All other appliances I have alternatives to use or can do without. We do have a generator to charge the batteries if need be and stored gas but I would really like to put something up next year to augment it. The BF wants to wait untill we have enough money to put the entire system up but I need to start now.
Once again thanks to all who have replied.

[grumble]

tadbit, have you ever considered the irony of putting up a solar electric system to operate grow-lights? <GGG>

[nadja]

Grumble, you hit that nail square on the head. Grow lights? Boy are you going to need a heck of a lot of solar for that little venture. Check out these wind generators.

www.beawindhog.com (http://www.beawindhog.com)

[tadbitangelny]

Yea it is a little ironic using solar to power grow lights but I have 2 dwarf bannana trees that have to have at least 6 hours of sun light a day. I also grow mint, oregano, thyme, basil, and 2 tomato plants during the winter. If we aren't going to get any sun for the day I have to turn the lights on. The bulbs are only 40 watts a piece (2 of them) and they have only added about $10 a month to our electric bill so I think I should be able to power them with solar. As I said our electric usage is about 500kw a month in the winter months. Does anybody using solar know how many KW they use a month I would be curious. We went on a green home tour 3 years ago and we talking to some families who were off grid and they said our usage was considered an energy efficient home to Federal standards. We do eventually want to incorporate wind but want to start with solar first.

[DavidOH]

Does anybody using solar know how many KW they use a month I would be curious.

Use the calculator that I linked to. :meeting:

[tadbitangelny]

David I was asking those who already use solar about how many KW a month they use. I know how much we use during the months and during start up loads (kill a watt ease). But thanks for the link anyways.

[12vman]

I use roughly 12-13 kW of power @ 12 volts D.C. per month. My laptop computer is the biggest power hog that I use on a daily basis.. ;)

[DavidOH]

David I was asking those who already use solar about how many KW a month they use. I know how much we use during the months and during start up loads (kill a watt ease). But thanks for the link anyways.

Sorry. You said "they". I thought you were referring to the light bulbs! :man_in_love:

[tadbitangelny]

Thanks everyone for being so helpful. I have asked for a invertor for Christmas and a charge controller for my birthday (March). I also started a solar panel fund and hope to be able to buy at least 2 220 watt panels before the summer. I know it is not alot but we have already installed a new electrical panel in the basement and we are thinking about just trying to switch over a light fixture or two on the solar and see how it goes. If the economy holds out next year we will probably buy more than two panels but we'll have to see how it goes. We never touch our savings for my "experiments" so I always start a "$$$$" fund and throw my spare cash in it. I will try to keep this thread up just to get everyones feed back on our progress. Thanks

[LaMar]

Starting small and building your system as you have the money is a good way to go. The first step is determining your power needs and reducing those needs so you don't need a large expensive system.

There are a lot of factors used in sizing a system and it requires some calculations based on where you live and how you live.

I have a series of videos on my 580 watt solar and 400 watt wind turbine system that might help you and I started with an even smaller system and have been off-grid for about 15 years.

http://www.youtube.com/solarcabin

LaMar