Hand loading .22 LR's

[crafty2002]

This may be a stupid question as cheap as they are from the factory, but can you hand load .22 LR's.
The reason I am asking is I wondered if you can load one maybe 10-25% hotter or is the shell already filled to the max.
Also could you load them using a better powder than what they come with.
I have never fooled with loading anything. Theclosest I ever came was having an old man load some for a 30.06 for me but one load he did for me put the group a lot closer at long range. I am just wondering if that is possible for the .22 also.
Thanks for any help.
Dennis

[OzarkMtnDaredevil]

This may be a stupid question as cheap as they are from the factory, but can you hand load .22 LR's.
The reason I am asking is I wondered if you can load one maybe 10-25% hotter or is the shell already filled to the max.
Also could you load them using a better powder than what they come with.
I have never fooled with loading anything. Theclosest I ever came was having an old man load some for a 30.06 for me but one load he did for me put the group a lot closer at long range. I am just wondering if that is possible for the .22 also.
Thanks for any help.
Dennis
Hide the p-38. Dennis wants to open a can of worms! :o

Yes, it's possible to play with .22 ammo but, I wouldn't consider it 'reloading' or even feasable.

I've deleted about 10 minutes worth of typing because I can. :-/

[crafty2002]

LMAOROTF, DareDevil. Hey, I keep the P-38 on my key ring. Please don't hid that from me. LOL.
I shot one box of bullets that hit a 3" group in 3 targets @100 yards. All 50 of them. They were FIOCCHI .22 LRHV CPSP's. The next box was the same type and out of the same order. I bought 6 boxes and all the rest was back out 5-6-7" and worse. Way worse for one box. But one whole box, 50 rounds was in a tight group. I shot 3 boxes that day. So it isn't the shooter. It isn't the rifle. It is the bullets. I would not mind paying a higher price if it isn't a killer price, to some one for hand loads that can stay in a 2-3" group @100 yards.
I don't want to get into handloading. Actually I do, but it is just late in my life to do so. It is something I don't have the money or the time to learn.
But I know from that one box that it isn't the rifle or the shooter that gets bigger groups, just like the rounds I have put back for the .06 ...
I have never met a rifle than didn't fall in love with a special bullet. I just don't know how to make them. Wish I did, but never took the time to learn it. That's bad too. It is something I could do now. Everything I spent time learning requires an able bodied man to preform. Now I am disabled. Go figure.
Dennis

[otterbob]

This may be a stupid question as cheap as they are from the factory, but can you hand load .22 LR's.
Dennis

No, you can not reload a 22 lr



I have never met a rifle than didn't fall in love with a special bullet. I just don't know how to make them. Wish I did,
Dennis

Try this , it will make them fall in love, most of the time !

http://www.gunblast.com/Paco.htm

Otter Bob

[OzarkMtnDaredevil]

Crafty. Are you pushing these down a semi? Groups enlarging is common with dirty .22s. What kind of bullets are you using? Copper coated will generally perform better than bare lead as there is less fouling of the barrel. You might try a good cleaning and watch your groups shrink.

[crafty2002]

Do you own one Bob, or have you just read about it?? What the article says kinda makes some sense but it also sounds like an article written just to promote the product.
If you have used one I would really be interested in hearing what you have to say about them.
I know the little Marlin I bought can go from 3-4" groups to double that and more with the change of a box of ammo. Sometimes even with the same box.
The grandboys and I shot a few rounds this morning with CCI, the cheap Thunderbolts, and Fiocchi. And it shot better today with the box of the cheap ones than the rest.
I don't understand it. I bought several different bullets to see what she likes and dang if she ain't picky about which box the dang bullets come from more so that which brand.
Like I said before, I haven't shot a .22 for a long time. Back when I did I just pointed and shot. I didn't know bullets had anything to do with accuracy. But now I am getting agitated. Especially after this monring. I shot the Fiocchi's first and missed the target with one bullet. That may have been because of a cold barrel. ???
But then I shot one 5 shot group in a 2 5/8" circle at 100 yards with the cheap ammo.
Let me see. OK, the 3rd target was with the CCI's and they were every where. About 5 1/2" from the center in.
Then I went back to the Thunder bolts and they were all 5 in a 6" circle. The same dang box I just got the 2 5/8" group in.
I could have dropped an 8 pointer this morning with the .06 and if I was comfortable with the .22 I WOULD Have dropped it. I looked him in the eye and he looked back at me. But I can't shoot the .06 here and I wasn't about to try to make the head shot not knowing where the bullet would hit.
That is one thing I really pride myself on. My ability to hit what I aim at and I don't want to wound a deer and let it run off somewhere and die, even tho sometime this summer when I see plants gone and deer tracks, I might think different.

And why can't you reload .22's
And but not least, what is a .22 mini mag??? Don't look at me like that. I told you I was dumb about a .22 ...... :'(
All I know is that if you are quite and take your time, you can kill a bunch of squirrels up close enough nearly any rifle would hit them, even when you are a kid.

[otterbob]

“Do you own one Bob,”

No,
My guns shoot “WELL ENOUGH” for the homestead. And I no longer need to “Stack bullets on the range”

“Then I went back to the Thunder bolts and they were all 5 in a 6" circle. The same dang box I just got the 2 *5/8" group in.”

Thunderbolts are made to go “Bang” not produce results .
Stick with good ammo if you want good results !

“That is one thing I really pride myself on. My ability to hit what I aim at and I don't want to wound a deer and let it run off somewhere and die, even tho sometime this summer when I see plants gone and deer tracks, I might think different.”

The 22 is NOT a deer rifle , yes many of us have taken deer with one, BUT,,, you must know where the “soft spots”
are in the head and choose the correct angle along with quickly closing the distance to the deer before the deer can recover enough to run and get a good well placed kill shot. “coup de gras”

“And why can't you reload .22's”

The firing pin crushes the case , also the priming compound would be too dangerous to handle saftly.

“And but not least, what is a .22 mini mag”

A CCI Trade Mark { Brand }

If you want a 22 lr in a “MAGNUM” then try the Remington Viper, CCI Velocitor , or Aquila interceptor.
I personally like the interceptor and viper and keep them in the ammo cabinet,
The interceptor I keep in the gun.

Otter Bob

[crafty2002]

Thanks for the help Bob. I really fill like a dumb @$$ now that you reminded me about the case for a rimfire. :-[
I have cleaned the rifle every time we went out and shot it so far thinking the same thing as you. But it doesn't seem to make any difference at all.
I have some Vipers and Velocitors both ordered. I will get a box of the interceptors next time I am at the gun store and try them too.
The only bullets I have that aren't plated is the Thunder bolts and I am about out of them. Actually I may be out of them. OK, I am out of them. I just looked to make sure.
If I can get a bullet I can trust to hit within about 3" @75 yards I can pepper a deers head with 4 or 5 shots from there real fast. I am not worried about me being able to make the shot. It's the ammo. I wish I could shoot the .06 out there. I wouldn't have any trouble cleaning house. There was 3 of them out there just before dark about 200 yards out. Just standing there and looking at me watch them. Heck, I would leave them alone if they would leave my garden alone. That's probably a lie, LOL.
Thanks again for the info.
Dennis
I know I had forgot how much fun the little things are to play with until now.

[Florida_boy]

As far as Paco's accurizer is concerned, if you want to learn more about them go to the leverguns.com forum. that is Paco's web site there are sticky's on the forum with information about them.
He's working on one now for the .22 mag as well.

[Penny_Plinker]

If I can get a bullet I can trust to hit within about 3" @75 yards I can pepper a deers head with 4 or 5 shots from there real fast. I am not worried about me being able to make the shot. It's the ammo. I wish I could shoot the .06 out there. I wouldn't have any trouble cleaning house.


Nobody can blame you for being tempted to shoot the deer in your yard, that meat standing there is always tempting. But if you can't shoot your 06 there, you must have close neighbors. You know, of course, you can't "pepper" a deer's head. You shoot once and if it's a perfect head shot the deer will likely drop. If it's not a perfect shot (deer might twitch its head) then it's gonna run and there's no chance to fire another round. So if it runs off into the neighbor's yard everyone is gonna think of that one neighbor who shoots his .22 a lot. If its jaw is broken or something they'll blame you and you might end up on the 6 o'oclock news as the cruel bad guy who wounded an animal with an illegal hunting weapon.... even though you wouldnt intentionally mean to wound anything.

I've had the same situation with Canada geese that come in the yard. Very tempted to shoot them with a .22, because they're big pests, but with my luck, they'd go die in someone's yard and i'd get the $700. fine.

I hope you can find some public land where you can go shoot a deer with your 30-06. It'd be less chancey for you.

Penny

[otterbob]

Crafty2002,
I do not want to pick on you !
Well,,, yea I do, because you seem like a good hearted person !

Most shooters I know would not shoot a deer with a 22 lr at a range further the 25 or 30 yards, the ones that do it regularly will not exceed 15 to 20 yards for a maximum distance, so that the shot can be placed exactly where they want it and maintain maximum bullet energy.

Understand that your idea of a 3 inch group is fine for 75 yards but you leave no room for error.
Notice from the “Rough” numbers for bullet drop below, when over-layed on your 3 inch group
for a rifle sighted in at 50 yards puts you up to 6” out at 75 yards. Please notice also that if you mis-judge the distance by just 10 ft you can add another 1” of variation, you are now 7” of variation in bullet flight, if you have ANY wind or are shooting off-hand, expectations of a well placed shot for a clean kill at 75 or so yards is almost non-existent.

50= 0.00
75= 3.00
100= 6.5 to 7
125= 11.5
150= 16.25
175= 21.5
200= 26.5 t0 27

Otter Bob

[Sarah]

Crafty2002

Some tidbits.

Back in the 1920s there was a kit, made by Samson, to pour ones own 22 brass, and load it. Today the brass is spun, not cast. Todays brass has an internal dimple which holds the primer, the cast units do not, so the older primers had to be more sensitive. Today other safer primers are used, so the comments above are valid.

The one we have in our little museum was for three different sizes, which do NOT match to todays. The only one that would have any practical use today is the long 'shot' cartridge. They will load unlike todays plastic nose shot rounds. It will reliably chamber in a standard 22LR 10/22.

If you look you can find modern long shot rounds. We did, so we stopped experimenting. CCI.

A couple of notes about Otterbobs notes. What he says about case crushing is true. There is a 'shoe' implement to press these dimples back out. But NOT recommended, as weakens the case severely. What he says about the primer is also true. Back then ANTI was used as the primer in rimfires, which is very dangerous. It is easy to make, and cheap, but now illegal to use. Today there is a replacement, but very expensive, and controlled.

If you come across another liquid rimfire primer, especially how to formulate, I would like to know of it.

Sarah

[OzarkMtnDaredevil]

Back then ANTI was used as the primer in rimfires, which is very dangerous. *It is easy to make, and cheap, but now illegal to use.
I've not heard anyone mention ANTI in a long time. If you're talking about Ammonium Nitrogen Tri-Iodide - yes, it's a fulminate; a HIGH EXPLOSIVE and you're advice to not mess with it is good advice.

[High_Desert]

I wanted to give some input on Paco and his .22 tool. I do have the tool, but have not had time to test it much. What I did want to say is Paco is a been there done that kind of person. I have used numerous recipe's of his in a wide selection of hanguns and rifles, almost all cast bullet loads. All were benificial to me. He seems to have quite a knack for finding what works with cast bullets and I dont have any reason to think the accurizer would not do what he says.

I wish I had hard data to present, but hope that any input would be good.

Best regards,
HD

[kawalekm]

Rather then trying to reload a .22 rimfire which is just about the most tedious, nerve racking, labor intensive, marginally productive activity I can think of, you should use that spent brass to make .22 jacketed bullets instead. Here is a pic of how I use SportFlite dies to convert cases into .22 bullets.
http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r55/kawalekm/Swaged22bullet.jpg

You will spend much less time doing this, and will also probubly save several more fingers and your eyesight then trying to make your own priming compound. Once you have your own bullets, you can reload a proper centerfire cartridge like the .22 hornet or a .223.
Michael

[DM]

Rather then trying to reload a .22 rimfire which is just about the most tedious, nerve racking, labor intensive, marginally productive activity I can think of, you should use that spent brass to make jacketed bullets instead. *Here is a pic of how I use SportFlite dies to convert cases into .22 bullets.


You will spend much less time doing this, and will also probubly save several more fingers and your eyesight then trying to make your own priming compound. *Once you have your own bullets, you can reload a proper centerfire cartridge like the .22 hornet or a .223.
Michael

You forgot to tell him how much it cost to get into it. I started turning jackets into bullets in the 70's and it was EXPENSIVE waay back then.

With what bulk packs of .224" bullets cost today, and on top of that, what 22 ammo cost today, it's really not worth it for anything other than a novelty or hobby...

DM

[Sarah]

I've not heard anyone mention ANTI in a long time. If you're talking about Ammonium Nitrogen Tri-Iodide - yes, it's a fulminate; a HIGH EXPLOSIVE and you're advice to not mess with it is good advice.


Which is why I posted it. I am aware that some of the old material is on the internet, and I did not want crafty2002 to get into trouble. Injury type or legal type.

I still wish that somebody would let me know of a modern liquid 'bridge' (bonds to case and powder when it dries) primer formulation.

Sarah

[ICanHelp]

Sarah,
Be very careful about even thinking about getting or having any raw priming compounds. They are all extremely dangerous to handle and current federal laws will make you a felon if you are caught making of handling this class of explosives.
If you want to work with a .22 rimfire just buy different brands until you find one you like.
If you want to poach a deer with a quiet rifle then get a .22 Hornet. This is a reloadable round is pretty quiet and will not give you any recoil. A well placed round from this rifle will drop a deer without any trouble.
If you want a legal cartrige then go with a .223 as this is deer legal in most states.
If you are having trouble with a 30-06 then get it checked to see if it fits you correctly and if it does then have some one teach you how to properly shoot it.
It sounds like you have a bad flinch and this is common with people that are shooting poorly fitted rifles or have been improperly introduced to a high power rifle.
Look up the closest gun range or quality gun shop to get help if you need.