monsanto

[bookwormom]

How many seed companies are really Monsanto in disguise?


http://survivingthemiddleclasscrash.wordpress.com/2009/02/05/the-multiple-ways-monsanto-is-putting-normal-seeds-out-of-reach/

[sbemt456]

Thanks Bookwormom, good info. Guess this is why we save our own,huh? ;)

Have a great day!

stella

[Anon001]

I will start by saying that I am definitely not a fan of Monsanto nor do I like some of the practices, however..... that blog or article had some truth to it but also had some garbage. *I worked in the seed/feed industry long enough to know. *Yes...it is illegal to buy a seed with Monsanto genetics.....it is patented...unless you have a technology contract with the seed company which is included in the cost of the seed. *

Every seed dealer that sells gm seed is also able to sell non gm seed with no trouble. *It is readily available. We always carried non gm seed as well as the gm seed.*

I will also say that not all gm seed is bad. * Some of the modifications are simple in terms of producing a corn that has higher oil content or higher protein etc.... but some is also bad.

And I will also say that the seed cleaners are NOT being put out of business by Monsanto unless they are cleaning seed that is not theirs to clean. *It is the farmers that continue to want and use newer gm modifications.... they aren't forced...they prefer it because it helps to increase their profit margin a great deal. *But, many seed cleaners have been forced out of business for cleaning Monsanto seed and selling it back to the farmer which is illegal... or cleaning seed the farmer brings in and claims is non gm when it isn't...it iw bin run. Why is it illegal, because Monsanto owns the patent on the seed genetics and you cannot plant seed you saved from the previous year if it has Monsanto genetics in it that is patented....

SO, there is a lot of exaggeration and fear mongering in that article. *I will also state that I am as anti-Monsanto as anyone... But keep in mind,....THE FARMERS ARE ASKING FOR THIS and Monsanto is ONLY supplying them with what they want to buy and plant.... and as long as it continues to increase the bottom line for the farmer, he/she will continue to ask for it and use it.

So then it becomes our responsibility to try to protect ourselves and our own families.

PaulNKS

[rAcErRicK]

Here is an extremely interesting video on this subject. Things are rarely what they seem to be any more.

http://coverockfarm.blogspot.com/2008/08/monsanto-gmos-pcbs-roundup-ready-crops.html

[backlash]

A couple of years ago one of the nurseries that supply trees to the farmers sued several farmers.
They claimed the farmers were using the trees they had purchased to start other trees.
If the farmer didn't have proof they had bought all the trees in their orchards they were forced to pay the nursery for the new trees.
Put some of them out of business.

[momma_to_seven_chi]

Did these farmers go to court over it, or just buckle under the threats?

I wouldn't hesitate to start plants from other plants I had purchased no matter who sued me, but that's just me.

[DiggingDogFarm]

Did these farmers go to court over it, or just buckle under the threats?

I wouldn't hesitate to start plants from other plants I had purchased no matter who sued me, but that's just me.

Many newer varieties of apples are either patented or have a trademarked name.

Unfortunately, many people feel that they are entitled to benefit from the many years of hard work by others without compensation or credit. It's stealing!

[yotetrapper]

Many newer varieties of apples are either patented or have a trademarked name.

Unfortunately, many people feel that they are entitled to benefit from the many years of hard work by others without compensation or credit. It's stealing!

So, if I go to Burger King and buy a hershey's pie, and then figure out at home how to make a hershey's pie, is that stealing? If I buy a tomato and save the seeds to plant, is that stealing? It's a fine line. If you can't graft a tree from a patented apple tree for your own use, then why should you be able to divide a clump of patented irises or daylillies to increase them?

[DiggingDogFarm]

If I buy a tomato and save the seeds to plant, is that stealing? It's a fine line. If you can't graft a tree from a patented apple tree for your own use, then why should you be able to divide a clump of patented irises or daylillies to increase them?

If it's a patented variety, yes, it's stealing.

Stick to the thousands of varieties that aren't patented if you want to legally and morally make increase, rather than taking advantage of others.

[TEX]

We go through this issue all the time as rose growers and propagators. Most patents only last about 20 years. While as a rose propagator I can propagate the heck out of anything as long as I don't sell the roses or profit from them. I think the patent runs out in 20 years but there are sites to look this sort of stuff up. People that develop new roses go through thousands of seedlings and many years of hard work plus lots of expense to develop a new rose. Their time, energy and money should be respected until that patent wears out. If you don't respect the patent you are indeed stealing their work.

[machinemaker]

Here is a great article regarding Monsanto's business operating style: http://www.acresusa.com/toolbox/reprints/interview_schmeiser_jan02.pdf
It is an interesting read. You might also want to look at the other articles from acres USA if you are into sustainable agriculture and gardening. There was also an artical in our sunday business section of the paper regarding a judge's ruling regarding the genetically engineered sugar beets. Basically until testing can be done on the safety of genetically engineered sugar beets the planting of them is outlawed after this years crop is harvested. The sugar producers have stated that they do not think that there is enough non GM seed for next years crop and that sugar from beets will be greatly reduced next year, ( expect sugar and anything containing sugar to increase in price). The head of the sugar beet growers organization is quoted that 95% of all commercial sugar beet seed comes from Monsanto and its subsideraries and it is all roundup ready GM seed.
kent

[NotSoFast]

We go through this issue all the time as rose growers and propagators. Most patents only last about 20 years. While as a rose propagator I can propagate the heck out of anything as long as I don't sell the roses or profit from them. I think the patent runs out in 20 years but there are sites to look this sort of stuff up. People that develop new roses go through thousands of seedlings and many years of hard work plus lots of expense to develop a new rose. Their time, energy and money should be respected until that patent wears out. If you don't respect the patent you are indeed stealing their work.
I don't care what you call it. Yes, they patented their tree. But since there is no control of how that tree is pollinated and fruit develops, what comes of that tree is mine to do with as I see fit, especially if I have other similar trees that are not from their patent nearby. They are becoming like the record industry, out to steal what isn't theirs in order to profit twice.

[TEX]

I don't care what you call it. Yes, they patented their tree. But since there is no control of how that tree is pollinated and fruit develops, what comes of that tree is mine to do with as I see fit, especially if I have other similar trees that are not from their patent nearby. They are becoming like the record industry, out to steal what isn't theirs in order to profit twice.


There is not an issue about the fruit or even the seeds from that fruit. I.E. I can do whatever I want with the roses and if they produce hips and I get one of the seeds to grow I can do whatever I want with the new rose.

The issue is cloning - taking a cutting and either rooting it or grafting it. You are making an exact copy of the patented plant. You are infringing on the patent. If you eat/sell fruit from an apple tree you are not. If you grow a new tree from a seed you are not. Only if you are making a clone.

[machinemaker]

Actually the issue isn't just cloning it is now legally established that Monsanto can own the fruits and demand the profit from farmers. If you have a crop that is not from patented seed, but the bees or the wind cross pollenate it with patented pollen then you have to either pay the equivalent of the cost of the seed you did not buy or pay a technology fee to the patent holder. This has been the legal president in all courts in both the USA and Canada and any country that respects patent law. This is what the article that I posted the link to talks about. A farmer in western Canada spent over 50 years developing seed that worked well in his area. Saving seed each year for planting and to improve his crop. Monsanto's patented plants cross pollenated with this farmers seed at some point, contaiminating 50 years of seed developement. Monsanto sued and won in court demanding payment equal to the cost of the seed the farmer did not buy from them, plus the profit from the sales that this farmer had for that year. It also required the farmer to not use any saved seed for future planting because it could have the patented monsanto gene. It is thought that in most of the USA and canada that all corn is now contaiminated with patented monsanto genes, even from organic farmers that have tried to keep their seeds pure. Monsanto has planted "test" plots of their patented products across the world knowing that it will contaiminate the gene pool through cross pollenation. If your plant get contaiminated with the marker genes in Monsanto's patents they own the plant whether you have paid for the "right" to grow it or not. Until we force the politicians to change the laws you are stuck with this. Oh ya, this farmer in Canada was also a politician in Parliment.
kent

[yotetrapper]

While I certainly agree that grafting scions from a patented fruit tree onto rootstock and then SELLING those new trees would be illegal and immoral, I do not believe that grafting a patented scion (from a tree you purchased) onto a limb of another variety of tree or even a rootstock and then growing that fruit yourself for stocking your pantry is theft. Maybe legally it is (I don't know?) but in my mind it is not.

I'll reference again daylillies - many daylillies are patented but yet dividing your daylily clumps is vital to their health and by the definition above, would be considered stealing?

[macgeoghagen]

who can patent life? These people are perverse in the extreme. It is like a vandal spray painting a big (C) over the last supper and claiming it as his own work. Then that same vandal sues the owner of the gallery for the overspray onto the walls and floor.

[jonvee]

In the video, they talk about how most of Mexico's native corn varieties have been contaminated by Monsanto corn. So I wonder why the reverse doesn't hold true - Monsanto has contaminated a native variety or organic variety.

Also, Monsanto has bought up so many seed companies that very few are left to purchase non GMO seeds from. In India only Monsanto has enough seed for all the cotton farmers and they sell it at three times what non GMO seed goes for. Plus, if farmers plant non GMO cotton seed and it gets contaminated by Monsanto GMO seed the farmer is put out of business. Secondly, the GMO seed is suseptable to some kind of rot and when the farmers can't produce enough to cover expenses they have to go to the money lenders to borrow.

It's a vicious cycle.

I'm not against business by any means, but when one company has such a hold over an industry isn't that considered a monopoly? And illegal?

And when 80% of soybeans are from Monsanto GMO seeds who do you really think is pulling the strings - certainly not the farmer. With Monsanto's reach, clout and protection from the govt/courts not to mention their eagerness to sue those who don't fall into line "the plant something else" argument doesn't hold water.

[rAcErRicK]

We all owe it to those we love to educate ourselves on this company and the horrors that are resulting from it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vj-G6VhUynY&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jeboa4TR5Qo&feature=related

There are MANY more vids and articles, one need only google a bit to find out what this monster is about.

(Sorry, I tend to lean towards vids because of vision problems, too much reading wipes me out)

[jonvee]

Rick - I watched the whole documentary last night and if you didn't believe in evil before, this video will change your mind. I'm just ashamed our county supervisors were so uneducated about this company that they let them in the county. God only knows what havoc they will wreck on our farmers when they start producing GMO seeds for tomatoes, peppers, broc...vegies like that.

[rAcErRicK]

:eek: Here is a wealth of knowlege on the topic !

http://www.laleva.cc/pharma/monsantofiles.html#Anchor-The-7431

More:

http://www.organicconsumers.org/dioxcov.html

And finally, the icing on the cake :

This new legal doctrine has recently been used to limit the liabilities of companies that marketed silicone breast implants. It is a creative legal invention which sharply limits the liability of corporations that market possibly-harmful products that have not been fully tested for safety. Recently more than 8 million Vietnam veterans asked the U.S. Supreme Court to review this new legal doctrine, on the ground that their Constitutional rights had been taken from them. The attorney generals of all 50 states joined with the vets asking the Supreme Court to review this new doctrine. [13] The Supreme Court refused. And that is one reason why companies are willing to risk exposing the general public to drugs in their food without fully understanding the consequences. Under doctrines invented by the Reagan/Bush courts, corporations are protected but the public is not.

http://www.organicconsumers.org/lawsuit.html

[rAcErRicK]

And now, after they control the seed (food), their sights are set on control of the water supply, the very source of life.

http://www.netlink.de/gen/Zeitung/1999/990511a.htm

[rAcErRicK]

And here is one for those who will say "exageration and fear mongering".

http://www.naturalnews.com/023254_Monsanto_PCB_PCBs.html

[leera]

Monsanto is just plain eveil,I just watched Food.Inc,and they are suing farmers for saving seed,they sued a guy right out of business who way being paid to clean seed for farmers....

They are getting away with murder basically...

Even though cross pollination is accidental,and not intentional,and even though the farmers can not control the wind directions,Monsanto still wins.....

[rAcErRicK]

If you aren't convinced of who and what they are, check this one out.

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2010/09/disney-monsanto-discovered-blackwaters-hidden-clients/

[West_TX_Desert_Rat]

While it doesn't cover the subject of GMO in depth, another great documentary is King Corn. I'm sure some of you have seen it. It shows just how screwed up things are.

[MotherCharlotte]

I can't bring myself to click on any of the links in this thread. I know it will be too upsetting and depressing. There is so little (if anything) any of us can do to fight against evil mega-corporations like Monsanto. I can't even bear to think about it.

[rAcErRicK]

An old thread from another section of BHM with ties to this one:

http://www.backwoodshome.com/forum/vb/showthread.php?t=1143

[leera]

What I don't understand is that the government,yeah I know,I stepping into a big ol' pile of something here.....can and will force large corporations to break up if they are getting too big and taking over,yet Monsanto has free run.....

One compnay is taking over the world's food supply and very few people seem to care.

[rAcErRicK]

What I don't understand is that the government,yeah I know,I stepping into a big ol' pile of something here.....can and will force large corporations to break up if they are getting too big and taking over,yet Monsanto has free run.....

One compnay is taking over the world's food supply and very few people seem to care.

That's an easy one Leera. :meeting:

http://www.politicalfriendster.com/rateConnection.php?id1=5580&id2=89

Or; just google: fed govt. in bed with monsanto, and take your pick.

Two of the planets shadyest companies are now in cahoots, woopie ! It's only going to get better !

http://food.change.org/blog/view/monsanto_got_in_bed_with_blackwater

[rAcErRicK]

Here is a vid. with interviews of several experts on the matter.

A must see.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VwA6lNVkH5g

[MotherCharlotte]

Okay, so I clicked on a few of the links...this stuff is horrible. Whether you believe the claim or not that Monsanto's ultimate goal is to kill off 80% of the world's population (that was in the comments of the last video), anyone who is not completely blind has to admit that this corporation is evil, has way too much power, and is poisoning us.

I feel especially sickened when thinking about such matters, because my husband and I are trying to raise our 3, soon to be 4 kids, as best we can living in the city for now. We desperately want to get some land, but we're broke to say the least. Hubby has had a hell of a time finding steady employment. How many more years are we going to have to eat industrialized crap before we can start producing our own food? Even if we buy all local food we still can't necessarily trust it. I see all the time signs in local corn fields saying it's an experimental strain and I get the creeps wondering if it's a GMO.

[rAcErRicK]

Yet another old thread with excellent information. This one even has a few BHM posters argueing FOR this monster !

http://www.backwoodshome.com/forum/vb/showthread.php?t=16652&page=2

[rAcErRicK]

And yet another.

http://www.backwoodshome.com/forum/vb/showthread.php?p=231597

[rAcErRicK]

I will start by saying that I am definitely not a fan of Monsanto nor do I like some of the practices, however..... that blog or article had some truth to it but also had some garbage. *I worked in the seed/feed industry long enough to know. *Yes...it is illegal to buy a seed with Monsanto genetics.....it is patented...unless you have a technology contract with the seed company which is included in the cost of the seed. *

Every seed dealer that sells gm seed is also able to sell non gm seed with no trouble. *It is readily available. We always carried non gm seed as well as the gm seed.*

I will also say that not all gm seed is bad. * Some of the modifications are simple in terms of producing a corn that has higher oil content or higher protein etc.... but some is also bad.

And I will also say that the seed cleaners are NOT being put out of business by Monsanto unless they are cleaning seed that is not theirs to clean. *It is the farmers that continue to want and use newer gm modifications.... they aren't forced...they prefer it because it helps to increase their profit margin a great deal. *But, many seed cleaners have been forced out of business for cleaning Monsanto seed and selling it back to the farmer which is illegal... or cleaning seed the farmer brings in and claims is non gm when it isn't...it iw bin run. Why is it illegal, because Monsanto owns the patent on the seed genetics and you cannot plant seed you saved from the previous year if it has Monsanto genetics in it that is patented....

SO, there is a lot of exaggeration and fear mongering in that article. *I will also state that I am as anti-Monsanto as anyone... But keep in mind,....THE FARMERS ARE ASKING FOR THIS and Monsanto is ONLY supplying them with what they want to buy and plant.... and as long as it continues to increase the bottom line for the farmer, he/she will continue to ask for it and use it.

So then it becomes our responsibility to try to protect ourselves and our own families.

PaulNKS

Paul said: "SO, there is a lot of exaggeration and fear mongering in that article."

rr says; SO, there is your opinion, now where's your proof ? Mine is here, for all the world to see and read, EXACTLY as I said. If the entire world backs something through ignorance, that does NOT make it right. Never has, never will.

[Laura]

I buy my seeds from Seeds of Change (http://www.seedsofchange.com/), Seed Savers Exchange (http://www.seedsavers.org/), and Baker's Creek......... (http://rareseeds.com/)

Tell me these are not 'owned' by this monsanto company??

This is the year of saving seeds for me!! I will save every seed I can get my paws on!!

[ScrubbieLady]

I buy my seeds from Seeds of Change (http://www.seedsofchange.com/), Seed Savers Exchange (http://www.seedsavers.org/), and Baker's Creek......... (http://rareseeds.com/)

Tell me these are not 'owned' by this monsanto company??

This is the year of saving seeds for me!! I will save every seed I can get my paws on!!

I buy from Baker Creek. They are not owned by Monsanto and they do not sell GMO seed (they even test for it). They sell heirloom seeds. Saving seeds only works if you are planting open pollinated seed. Hybrid seed will not come back true.

If Monsanto is so worried, why don't they produce sterile seed?

[cinok]

Is anybody here a major AG producer? Probably not, if you are then you would under stand bushel to acre ratios and how slim the margians are. If a seed increases yeild then thats more profit (sometimes that is all the profit).

[oldtimer]

Monsanto was sued by a friend of mine from here in SD. THis man and his family had raised alfalfa for seed for 70 years. Monsanto came out with Round-up ready alfalfa. Bees can carry the pollen from this 2 and a half miles in one direction in any year. If their alfalfa crosses with yours, then their patented genetics are found in your seed even though you never bought it, wanted it, nor asked for it because of the bees. This man sued Monsanto and won, so he can raise alfalfa and Monsanto was suppose to stop producing the junk. It has gone on to an appeals court where surprise surprise, Monsanto won.
As far as playing with the genetics being, "good" don't kid yourself. The modified corn is killing us. You can scarcely find any corn anywhere that hasn't been contaminated by GMO corn. You can't stop bees or the spread of pollen unless you're on an island ten miles from the nearest other crop.

[ScrubbieLady]

If GMO was so great, then they would label it as such.

[JarDude]

Is anybody here a major AG producer? Probably not, if you are then you would under stand bushel to acre ratios and how slim the margians are. If a seed increases yeild then thats more profit (sometimes that is all the profit).

Depending on your idea of "major". I am.