You can save money on fuel like I am.

[turboRC]

First you need a diesel truck, car or anything that runs in diesel. Gather up used motor and transmission fluid. Mix 50 50 with diesel. Run it threw a fuel filter water separtor (1 to 10 micron you can get at TSC in the farm diesel section that has the clear outside so you can see the water and also tape some magnets to it.). Pour it in your diesel and enjoy half price. It's just that easy. Works best on 1996 and older trucks. Newer than 1996 use 70% diesel. Motor oil has more BTU's diesel so you'll probably enjoy better mpg! Hope this helps your life! Turbo

[turboRC]

Running the mix for a year. Never changed a filter in my truck yet. I've run 60,000 miles on the oil mix. If you want to try it. Go to walmart and buy some new walmart brand oil. It's 8.00 for 5 quarts. Buy 2 of these put in a 5 gallon gas can then fill the rest of the way with diesel. Pour in your ride and try it.

[DM]

I've been doing the same thing for several years... The only thing is, i only burn my own used oil, and i let the used oil sit in jugs for a week or so to let the "heavies" settle out before using it for fuel.

I've run it in my pu's, and other equipment and it works fine...

I don't use it in the winter, because the oil raises the pour point, and will cause the fuel to gell easily in the cold weather...

DM

[chrisser]

Not to be a spoil sport or to suggest you don't do this, but it is probably illegal on several levels.

Particulates, heavy metal compounds in the exhaust, not to mention the road taxes not being paid if you drive on the public roads with this mixture...

Again, not saying you shouldn't do it, just saying you should be aware, as you should in any endeavor, of the breadth and potential consequences of your actions.

Hey, if it catches on, maybe we'll have "red" motor oil next to go with the red kerosene and red diesel...

[DM]

I don't think you have to worry about tax on small amounts that you do not SELL to anyone...

Secondly, Cummins offered as an option for a time, (maybe still does?) a system that drew off motor oil as you drove, and burned it... You had a clean oil tank you kept filled, and as you drove you were changing your oil.... Every so many miles, you changed the oil filters...

It worked for them, it works for me...

DM

[1stmate]

$Cha ching$
Are you kidding?
I've never heard of this! I have a diesel tractor & change my own oil in all my vehicles, soooooo...
No ill effects to the motor or in starting ease?
This kicks a$$ if it's all good...
Anyone else out there try it?

1stmate

[ryanmercer]

That just sounds illegal to me... if it wasn't I imagine someone would be selling a product to filter the oil on late night tv. I can't imagine the added emissions from it are too great for the environment either.

[DM]

That just sounds illegal to me... if it wasn't I imagine someone would be selling a product to filter the oil on late night tv. I can't imagine the added emissions from it are too great for the environment either.

People are doing it every day all over the U.S... You don't need some "spl." filter either...

I wouldn't put it in a new puterized diesel with all the sending units, but it works perfectly in all of my mechanical diesels here on my place...

Mixed 50/50 you can't even tell it's in there....and makes excelent summer fuel.

DM

[ryanmercer]

People are doing it every day all over the U.S... You don't need some "spl." filter either...

I wouldn't put it in a new puterized diesel with all the sending units, but it works perfectly in all of my mechanical diesels here on my place...

Mixed 50/50 you can't even tell it's in there....and makes excelent summer fuel.

DM


Just because people are doing it doesn't mean it is illegal... People moonshine, people grow marijuana... doesn't make it legal.

[ryanmercer]

I don't think you have to worry about tax on small amounts that you do not SELL to anyone...


I wouldn't be so sure about that. If you make ANY amount of bio-diesel you are supposed to pay tax on it. Even if it's just a gallon. People have been getting in hot water from it... I believe 2 or 3 months ago in Mother Earth News they did an article on it and how you need to read up on what you have to pay and who you have to pay before you go making bio-diesel... I imagine the same goes for motor-oil as fuel.

[WRTN]

I've found that pouring the oil into a large container such as a milk jug or other large see through container and allowing the jug full of oil to set undesturbed for several weeks allows nearly all of the contaminants to settle out of the oil. Just pour off the clean stuff and run it through a coffee filter just to be sure and it burns just fine.

I mix the Walmart 2 stroke oil in the gallon jugs in my diesel fuel for my truck at about 100 : 1 for injection and lift pump lubrication purposes. The most recent ULSD diesel does not have near the lubricity of the original #2 diesel formula. Another good way to bring up the lubricity of ULSD is to add at least 2% biodiesel.

If you decide to make your own biodiesel, I would just keep that bit of info. under my hat. The less people know about your business the better. That goes for big brother especially.

This type of oil recycling has been going on in the marine and over the road trucking industry for many years.

[DM]

*People are doing it every day all over the U.S... *You don't need some "spl." filter either...

*I wouldn't put it in a new puterized diesel with all the sending units, but it works perfectly in all of my mechanical diesels here on my place...

*Mixed 50/50 you can't even tell it's in there....and makes excelent summer fuel.

*DM

I reread my post and i can't see where i said it was "legal"??

BUT, it's just as legal as pouring 2 stroke oil in your fuel, or buying an additive from wally world and pouring that into the fuel.

BTW, i'm a farmer and this a farming community, and i've never heard of even one person get bothered for running used oil in there diesel... And what about the Cummins option that puts crankcase oil in the fuel to burn it, as new oil is added from a tank??

I know a guy that put a 4 cyl Cummins diesel in an old Chev pu, and he's been running it on "straight" used oil for over two years now...

They only check you for red fuel here...

DM

[DavidOH]

If you make ANY amount of bio-diesel you are supposed to pay tax on it.

No. Up to 300 gallons without Federal Road Fuel Tax.
You may even get a tax credit for buying it.
State taxes.....well that's another thing. ::)

http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/p510.pdf

[ryanmercer]

No. Up to 300 gallons without Federal Road Fuel Tax.
You may even get a tax credit for buying it.
State taxes.....well that's another thing. ::)

http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/p510.pdf

Alright 300 gallons, and that is what, a year? *shrugs*

Back to burning motor oil, I still say it is not good for the environment, and illegal.

[BIGGKIDD]

I bet burning used motor oil is a lot better for the enviroment than these jokers in the poor areas of the cities who are still changing their oil by draining it in the nearest ditch. I see that happening in my own neighborhood. After telling them they could just leave it at the end of my drive. Guy told me it was to much work that he would keep dropping it in the ditch. Glad he got evicted.... Amazingly at the same time my trucks stopped getting broken in to. Which was happening about every ten days. I think he got paid every two weeks. When he ran short he would just hit cars near by for toll money until he had what he needed.

Larry

[ryanmercer]

You know... I've been wanting to buy an older vehicle just to tinker on, to develop mechanical skills... now I'm half tempted to look for an older diesel. After doing some thinking... I realize tons of cars are already burning oil, from leaks so what's it really gonna matter... if only I had a steady supply to sued motor oil ;)

[PK.]

If you look around you can find older, mechanical diesel engines in the 100-200hp range pretty reasonable. *I have several buddies who have taken these motors for their muddin' trucks and rock crawlers. I believe they got their engines out of Ottawa style yard trucks.



*

[ryanmercer]

It is not illegal. The new trucks perform an oil change while driving. The old oil is injected to the fuel system to be burned and the new oil is injected into the crankcase, all of this done in the lower 48 while driving down the road. If there are any doughts, take it to an emissions tester and have it tested, if it fails, then yes it is bad for the environment, but it burns at such a high temp/pressure, the oil gets burned up. Even engines that use/burn oil will pass emissions. Excessive oil consumption will not cause you to fail an emissions test. Excess unburned fuel will, or the engine running too hot will. Of course, failed components will also.

Just don't start making large quantities and start selling it.

Indiana doesn't have emissions test, so no emissions testers.

[DM]

You know... I've been wanting to buy an older vehicle just to tinker on, to develop mechanical skills... now I'm half tempted to look for an older diesel. After doing some thinking... I realize tons of cars are already burning oil, from leaks so what's it really gonna matter... if only I had a steady supply to sued motor oil ;)

What are you saying, now that YOU decided you'd like to do it too, it's "ok" if it's "illegal" and "bad for the enviorment"?? lol lol

DM 8)

[ryanmercer]

What are you saying, now that YOU decided you'd like to do it too, it's "ok" if it's "illegal" and "bad for the enviorment"?? lol lol

DM 8)

Screw my grandchildren... I'm on Terra now, and I want my full use out of her hahahah.

[MooseToo]

i guess sometimes folks will search out obscure laws and regs to follow - wouldn't want to get out from under the thumb of govmint -

[turboRC]

DM thanks for your input. You might be the smartest person I've had the pleasure of meeting on the net!

And yes I'm still burning oil in my 93 6.5 turbo truck! Our coldest day was 18 degrees and it started right up with a 50/50 mix.

[turboRC]

msta999 powerstroke will burn oil fine if it's a 1997 or older. DM can tell why this is because I can't. 97 and newer your run a 70/30 mix. It has something to do with emission controls?

[stully]

Great thread. As far as the legal issue is concerned, where in the constitution does it say one may not burn an oil mix? There are two types of people in the world, those who follow the human law and those who bow to any person in a supposed role of authority. Keep the great info coming.

[Travis]

This is very illegal but what the goverment doesn't know won't hurt them. Now if you had a 2k still out back that would be hard to talk your way out of. But if you had a 55 gallon drum of it who would be the wiser. I would advise not running "I make biodiesel" bumper stickers on your truck.

[DM]

This is very illegal but what the goverment doesn't know won't hurt them. Now if you had a 2k still out back that would be hard to talk your way out of. But if you had a 55 gallon drum of it who would be the wiser. I would advise not running "I make biodiesel" bumper stickers on your truck.


Once again, "if" it's so illegal, why did Cummins offer it on their OTH trucks as an option??? Seems to me if it was illegal the gov would have stopped it the day it was offered!

DM

[Travis]

Once again, "if" it's so illegal, why did Cummins offer it on their OTH trucks as an option??? Seems to me if it was illegal the gov would have stopped it the day it was offered!

DM


Do not about/why/how Cummins how/is getting away with it. I know some people have gotten in trouble for running homemade biodiesel because they did not pay the highway tax. Personally I would do it and not say a word about it.

[Anon001]

I think some of it depends on the type of "biodiesel".

One example is that you can make your own ethanol but, you are fequired by federal law to get a "license" because ethanol is nothing more than moonshine.

Different laws apply to different types of bio-fuels. (I think?) lol

Paul

[cinok]

Once again, "if" it's so illegal, why did Cummins offer it on their OTH trucks as an option??? Seems to me if it was illegal the gov would have stopped it the day it was offered!

DM
It is not illegal to run untaxed fuel offroad. If you have ever bought deisel fuel in an Ag area you would see fuel that is sold for off road use only it is ussally dyed red. Fuel that is for highway use is not dyed. Big time fine for useing off road fuel for on highway use. Their is nothing wrong with using homemeade fuel in a vechicle as long as you pay the tax on the fuel that you use.

[chrisser]

I did a little research.

Surprisingly, the EPA is OK with burning WMO. Here's one reference.

http://www.michigan.gov/documents/deq/deq-ess-p2tas-generatormotoroil_190425_7.pdf

In a rare (and likely fleeting) moment of practicality, even though they would prefer recycling, they seem to recognize that burning is less harmful than the oil getting into the fresh water stream.



Also found that Cummins didn't recommended more than 5% WMO in the diesel fuel for their engines. Most fleets still doing this are heavily filtering the WMO with either a 1 micron or centrifuge filter. Otherwise, long term there are issues with filter/injector plugging and valvetrain coking. Seems the current practice is to collect the oil at oil changes, then process it at a central location and feed it in measured amounts into the fuel.

Can't imagine running unfiltered 50% is going too last long, but I suppose if it's occassional use, it might be years before it catches up to you.

[DM]

It is not illegal to run untaxed fuel offroad. If you have ever bought deisel fuel in an Ag area you would see fuel that is sold for off road use only it is ussally dyed red. Fuel that is for highway use is not dyed. Big time fine for useing off road fuel for on highway use. Their is nothing wrong with using homemeade fuel in a vechicle as long as you pay the tax on the fuel that you use.

With all the diesel tractors i have around here, i do buy "red" fuel, but "OTH" stands for "over the hiway", so Cummins intended the used oil to be used "on road", not off.

I use up to 50/50 and i don't give a hoot who knows, and yes it's filtered. I've been doing this for many years in tractors AND my diesel pu's. It hurts nothing on my old non puterized diesels.

I still say, if it was illegal, Cumming wouldn't have offered it as an option on the diesels going in OTH trucks.

DM

[Oblio13]

There's a reason you take that old oil OUT of your engine. Don't put it back in, especially at the top end. :wacko:

Your engine's not engineered for it, you can't filter the acids and toxins out, magnets won't remove most metals.

You'll save a few bucks on fuel, but it will shorten the life of your injectors and injector pump, especially if you have a turbo-diesel electric pump. It's penny-wise and dollar-foolish. Injector pumps have VERY tight tolerances.

Most diesel fuels don't need additives. If you feel the need for, say, added lubricity, then use a product specifically designed for it.

Last but not least are the environmental issues. Look at a used-oil analysis to see all the nasty stuff in there. You wouldn't pour that on the ground or in a creek, so why would you want it in the air?

Bottom line: Don't pour anything in your fuel tank that wasn't designed for the purpose.

[DM]

There's a reason you take that old oil OUT of your engine. Don't put it back in, especially at the top end. :wacko:

Your engine's not engineered for it, you can't filter the acids and toxins out, magnets won't remove most metals.

You'll save a few bucks on fuel, but it will shorten the life of your injectors and injector pump, especially if you have a turbo-diesel electric pump. It's penny-wise and dollar-foolish. Injector pumps have VERY tight tolerances.

Most diesel fuels don't need additives. If you feel the need for, say, added lubricity, then use a product specifically designed for it.

Last but not least are the environmental issues. Look at a used-oil analysis to see all the nasty stuff in there. You wouldn't pour that on the ground or in a creek, so why would you want it in the air?

Bottom line: Don't pour anything in your fuel tank that wasn't designed for the purpose.


And could you please speak to the reason why Cummins, the mfg of the engine, not only says it's alright, but even offered it as an option to do so??

I figure they know more about this than anyone here does...

DM

[Oblio13]

And could you please speak to the reason why Cummins, the mfg of the engine, not only says it's alright, but even offered it as an option to do so??

I figure they know more about this than anyone here does...

DM

You're referring to the "Centinal" system. It was offered only on older heavy-duty engines. It used a mix of 5% or less, not the 30%-50% mixes being advocated here.

The option was discontinued after '06. You can interpret that any way you like.

Those older, heavy-duty engines are antiques. They injected fuel at something like 3,000-4,000 psi. Some engines are injecting in the neighborhood of 20,000 psi.

Think of your injectors as tiny, super-high-pressure, super-high-heat "sand blasters", one in each cylinder. Any particles, no matter how small, are slowly sand-blasting your piston tops and cylinders, hogging out your injectors, and grinding away in your injector pump and other parts. Contaminants are carbonized when the cylinder fires. A mix of abrasives and abraded material then starts working on your top piston rings, cylinder walls, valves and etc. This is a slow process. It happens even with the cleanest diesel. It happens a lot faster when you add dirt to your fuel.

Put some clean diesel in a jar, beside a jar of filtered waste oil. Let them sit for a few days, see what you think.

ATF has also been mentioned in this thread. ATF is a hydraulic fluid, not a fuel. Why not use brake fluid or differential oil? Lots of things will burn in a compression engine. The question is how WELL they will burn. Your tank isn't like "Mr. Fusion" from "Back To The Future". I don't understand the obsession people seem to have with dumping stuff in their fuel tanks.

If you want to save money on fuel, slow down a bit.

If you want to save money on repairs, don't put dirt and contaminants in your fuel tank.

If you want to burn used oil, do it in a garage heater or something designed for the purpose, that isn't injecting it at thousands of psi.

Cars are probably the most expensive things any of us will ever own. Unlike homes and property, they are consumable items. We use them up and throw them away. If you take care of a modern diesel car, there's no reason it can't last for at least 300,000 miles. "Taking care" of it includes not putting dirt in the fuel tank.

[DM]

First of all, many trucking companys are still doing it with their fleets today. But, if you read my post, you would know that i stated "more than once" that i have older diesels.

As for the "mix" killing them, i have 3 pickups. One has 200,000 miles on it, the others are 100,000 and 95,000 and all are fine. I have several diesel tractors and a dozer that all are fine. I also know a guy with an mid 60's Chevy pu that he but a 4 cyl Cummins in, and he runs nearly all oil in the summer. He's been doing it for close to 10 years now.

I may along with many others be killing our diesels, but i for one, won't live long enough to see it.

DM

[Oblio13]

... if you read my post, you would know that i stated "more than once" that i have older diesels...

The original post isn't limited to older diesels, and specifically states "Newer than 1996 use 70% diesel".

... I may along with many others be killing our diesels, but i for one, won't live long enough to see it.

When you sell a used diesel, do you tell the prospective buyers what you've been putting in the fuel tank?

[DM]

Sell one??? When i get done with them no one is worried about that, as they are rusted out junk! I bought my first diesel pu in 1982, it's still here, and it's still a decent pu.

DM

[NativeMsSon]

Great info. Gives me something to do with all of the used oil i have stored. Of course I only have a diesel tractor.