View Full Version : Questioned at a roadblock
kawalekm
03-19-2007, 09:27 AM
Recently after visiting relatives in Yuma, Arizona I had to stop at an immigration roadblock on HW 8. It was a typical pass through a toll kind of stop where all vehicles are checked for transporting illegals. I don't know if the officers there were border patrol, deputies, or immigration agents.
After saying "Good Day Sir" the officer asked "where have you been today?". I really had to try hard not to lose it! Instead of losing my temper and blurting out "Its none of your business where I've been", I looked over at my family, wiped the anger off my face, and simply stated "I was visiting family in Yuma."
My question though is if I made the first statement instead of the second, what authority does that officer have to make my life miserabe? Would I likely get an appology, or would I more likely be directed off the the side for "additional questions"?
frost_bite
03-19-2007, 09:58 AM
It's a tuff call...were you alone re acting in anger would be okay. But, with your family present I think you did good to let it slide. I say that because I know that checkpoint very well, being between Yuma and El Centro with a lot of nothing but empty desert in between. You had to put the welfare of your family first..
Peace,
Steady, good choice, a little good faith diplomacy, shouldn't hurt. Or politely disregard his query, and simply retort,
"How may I assist you, deputy, officer, trooper, as you look for a nametags and/or badge????
Leave him/her chance to "tin up" and Identify the way he/she wants you to refer to him/her. I believe they are required.
Why were they not Identifiable, as Peace Officers or Sheriffs, or any kinda of badge I am confused.?
Peace
kawalekm
03-19-2007, 11:26 AM
They were dressed in black SWAT style fatigues, not regular uniforms. At the moment, I didn't think to determine their affiliation. I just got catch up in being so angry about having to explain my comings and goings and just wanted to get out of there without blowing up.
candy
03-19-2007, 11:32 AM
Cops can and do arrest people for cussing at them.
It is easy to make up a obstruction of justice charge, they can deem just about anything as obstructing justice.
Personally I do not see what the problem is. If it's a high traffic illegal area. I am glad to know they have road blocks set up.
Since you didn't like his attempt at keeping it light, would you have preferred he just asked, Got any illegals in there? Same difference in my mind.
DaNgEr_KiTtY
03-19-2007, 01:30 PM
cops can arrest you anytime they want. cops also lie & say things that arent true on occasions, even in a courtroom.
Peace,
They were dressed in black SWAT style fatigues, not regular uniforms. At the moment, I didn't think to determine their affiliation. I just got catch up in being so angry about having to explain my comings and goings and just wanted to get out of there without blowing up.
yep know what you mean.
Peace
frost_bite
03-19-2007, 05:42 PM
I may be wrong, but I get the feeling that you live in the San Diego area. If you want, PM me, and I'll give you a route that will do an end run around that check point. It's a few miles longer and a bit slower. However, it's more scenic then 8.
kawalekm
03-20-2007, 01:56 AM
No, I live about 100 miles north of S.D. I don't usually ever travel on HW 8, so it was the first time I ever passed through that particular check point. I suppose if I was used to it, I would have been better prepared for questions I think violate my rights.
frost_bite
03-20-2007, 02:37 AM
100 miles N of SD....I've a general ideal of several places that falls within that range, so let's keep it there and not put out any more info on your location. *If interested, I can PM you several back road routes that avoids all checkpoints, including the ones at Temecula, and north of Oceanside on 5 that you can use as a spring board to head home from.
Just know, the last thing I want to do is post that info in the open here. Just too many pro big daddy government, pro LEO types infesting this Board
Mac_Muz
03-20-2007, 11:09 AM
i carry about 6 of these with my lic.. and when I give my lic over I hand one of these over never saying one word...
Statement of Constitutional Rights
Officer, I mean no disrespect, but I understand my rights. I have the right to have an attorney present during questioning. I have the right to refuse to consent to any search of my body, and personal effects. I wish to exercise all my rights. If I am under arrest I wish to invoke and exercise my Miranda rights and be allowed the opportunity to obtain the advise of attorney. If I am to be taken into custody I request a reasonable opportunity to make arrangements to secure my own property. I do not consent to any impoundment of my property. If I am not under arrest, I want to leave. If I am free to leave, please tell me immediately so that I my go about my business.
Peace,
Statement of Constitutional Rights
Officer, I mean no disrespect, but I understand my rights. I have the right to have an attorney present during questioning. I have the right to refuse to consent to any search of my body, and personal effects. I wish to exercise all my rights. If I am under arrest I wish to invoke and exercise my Miranda rights and be allowed the opportunity to obtain the advise of attorney. If I am to be taken into custody I request a reasonable opportunity to make arrangements to secure my own property. I do not consent to any impoundment of my property. If I am not under arrest, I want to leave. If I am free to leave, please tell me immediately so that I my go about my business.
;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;)
NNNNNNNIIIIIIIIIIIIICCCCCCCCCCCEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!! !!!
Peace
Txanne
03-21-2007, 01:46 AM
They were dressed in black SWAT style fatigues, not regular uniforms. *At the moment, I didn't think to determine their affiliation. *I just got catch up in being so angry about having to explain my comings and goings and just wanted to get out of there without blowing up.
At border check points I would have understood---Border patrol agents.
What you describe is scary at best---UnConstitutional to say the lest.
It is now unConstitutional in Texas to have road blocks--Boy we use to have them here every time you turned a corner. No More tho!
You can thank Homeland Security--the patriot act--for the total Warrantless invasion of your right to travel--
Did these black-suited goose steppers every give you any hint as to what they were really up too.
There are times when it is very very wise to hide--in plain site--go along to get along---or in other words secure your families safety.
Because your 6th sense told ya---buddy I cant win this one---
Reading this makes the hair on the back of my neck stand up---Black shirts--no warrants---no probale cause?
Isolated areas--?
Hear that train coming?
Txanne
nancy1340
03-21-2007, 02:45 AM
Every time I have ridden to Big Bend Park I have had to go through a check point on the way back. Here I was a 48 year old, very blond woman on a full dress Harley and their asking me if I am a US citizen! ::) All I can do is shake my head and ask them if it embarrasses them to have to ask that question. The last time the guy just smiled and said "Please answer the question" but he did blush.
BTW the check point is a full 75 miles from the border.
Txanne
03-21-2007, 03:40 AM
He was blushing cause he just wet him-self!! ;D
''please ans the question''---I wonder if they are phyic? How would they know the truth?
Not giving a reply must be probable cause huh?
annie
Mac_Muz
03-21-2007, 04:10 AM
333, Seems to work for me. I tend to be hard of hearing and more so in the presence of cops.
The one time that didn't work I was in flull blown buckskinner dress with a flintlock pistol in plain sight, and a horse in a trailer. I had been parked eatting food I bought in a private resturant parking lot in MASS... I had been given several pails of water for the horse as well, so I wasn't exactly a threat on my way home from an event.
No sooner did I pull onto the road I was pulled over at maybe 10 mph reading to get on the Interstate. The cop said I was a suspious looking character (I guess to hell I was !) Sure guys in buck skins always rob banks huh? ::)
The cop got busy looking at my pistol and appeared to be trying to open a muzzel loader a tad to hard.. I had plenty of time to remove his Glock had I wanted to...
After 45 minutes which way past my limits I demanded his badge number which I already had, and demanded to be let go or arrested, and have the horse cared for at any local vet or other so equipted and I'ld see him flipping burgers after I was done in court...
he decided to let me go...
.................................................. .............
nancy a full dressed HD? WAUGH! i KNEW i LIKED YOU.... oops that caps key thing but it looks good so I am leavin' it.... ;D
nancy1340
03-21-2007, 04:43 AM
Mac, great story. But 45 min? What a dolt he must have been. ::)
And thanks. :-*
A 25 year member of AMA and TMRA.
Started riding HD's in early '85.
Joined HOG from the get go.
In fact when I joined it was called HDOA I think.
My HD's have always been named "My Priority".
Rafael
03-21-2007, 06:31 AM
Nobody likes these roadblocks. But it is supremely stupid to piss off or argue with someone who is armed. Be calm, play it smart and after you leave you can make an appropriate complaint and have your lawyer file a lawsuit.
Where I live they have these random roadblocks where they run your car license number and your drivers license. I have a buddy who works for the LAPD who says they get at least a few stolen cars and several wanted felons every time they set up one of these blocks and they impound at least 20 cars from unlicensed(illegal aliens) drivers. He says the police hate doing them because they consider them dangerous to their safety.
nancy1340
03-21-2007, 06:43 AM
Here , TX, if you lawyer up and have a CCW you risk the loss said license & being able to carry concealed.
Mac_Muz
03-21-2007, 12:27 PM
I think he was one of them badge pushin newbie cops.. and I was tryin to decide if he should live, or die by his own gun...
He was busy trying to pry open a gun that doesn't load from the back end he totally lost track of where I was..
Standing as I was right behind him and off set slightly to his right.. Had I been the villian type he would have been road kill....
He didn't like my pound and a half bowie either..... oh well....
Whats that? "lawyer up and can loose a CCW?? I am not so sure I understand....
Raf I never leave home with out pants, and my gun is already on my pants when I put them on....
So far as I am concerned any state refusing my permit is in violation of the Cons...
I rode my bike from NH to Cal, from Cal to Fla armed every last inch of that ride and then some more thru evil NY twice and Mass once... screw em... I know all there is to know about "To Serve and Protect" and thats just bull....
That little paper gets the idea over pretty well that I know my RIGHTS, and once they know that they don't want much to do with you. The see law suit all over the place...
Being not all that bad of a boy I tend to let a screw up pass, but step on my toes and play tuff guy and you get a new job slinging burgers... try it some time it's lots of fun ;D
nancy1340
03-21-2007, 12:56 PM
Whats that? "lawyer up and can loose a CCW?? *I am not so sure I understand....
"Lawyer Up" is the term cops use when they are questioning a perp, suspect or anyone they want to question, and he/she says , "I will not talk to you or answer any of your questions without a lawyer present".
When you get your CCW you MUST comply with all request and questions presented to you by a law enforcement officer or you risk having your CCW taken away. :(
I think I'd risk it if I had someone try to break in my home and I had to use my gun to protecy me or my loved one's life. I'd respectfully tell the officers "I will come into the police station with my lawyer, tomorrow".
Apparently that works if it's clear cut self-defence.
Txanne
03-21-2007, 01:07 PM
Nobody likes these roadblocks. But it is supremely stupid to piss off or argue with someone who is armed. Be calm, play it smart and after you leave you can make an appropriate complaint and have your lawyer file a lawsuit.
Where I live they have these random roadblocks where they run your car license number and your drivers license. *I have a buddy who works for the LAPD who says they get at least a few stolen cars and several wanted felons every time they set up one of these blocks and they impound at least 20 cars from unlicensed(illegal aliens) drivers. He says the police hate doing them because they consider them dangerous to their safety.
Sooooooo it is Constitutional to go againest the constitution?
Roadblocks--except in the pursuit of a fleeing murderer/rapist or child-aboduction--are Wrong---
Cops are not lawyers or judges--they only have a small window of interpetation of the law.
The police--academy isnt a law school--its a survival school.
Cops on lonely roads---scare the bejjebbers out of annie---
Wrong is wrong regardless which spin you put on it.
annie
Mac_Muz
03-21-2007, 01:09 PM
HUH? You have to give up RIGHT"S to get a CCW? Not in NH you don't.... Oh sure if you give up your RIGHTS they are willing to help you out giving them up, but there is no price for refusal other them telling lies....
on edit: If I catch a bad guy in my home his first name is gonna be bait...
nancy1340
03-21-2007, 01:41 PM
Mac, that's what they told me the last time I took the CCW class. I even asked them twice if that was true.
I am due for renewal before Aug. this year. Argggggggggggggggg >:(
My drivers license is good for something like five years but the CCW is every two years. Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
Txanne
03-22-2007, 02:02 AM
MAC
Texas has a new Castle Law in its house that the Governor is expected to sign---we can now Legally shoot someone in our homes---we dont have to try to [[flee]]-
Its always been sticky situation here--if you had a break in---
Nancy --My renewal is this year also.
I'll wonder what new sneaky rules they'll put on our right to bear arms?
annie
Mac_Muz
03-22-2007, 02:06 AM
Well that sucks if it is true..... In NH the CCW is good for 5 years, and you really won't like this..... it costs $10.00..
hilltopdude
03-22-2007, 02:24 AM
Statement of Constitutional Rights
Officer, I mean no disrespect, but I understand my rights. I have the right to have an attorney present during questioning. I have the right to refuse to consent to any search of my body, and personal effects. I wish to exercise all my rights. If I am under arrest I wish to invoke and exercise my Miranda rights and be allowed the opportunity to obtain the advise of attorney. If I am to be taken into custody I request a reasonable opportunity to make arrangements to secure my own property. I do not consent to any impoundment of my property. If I am not under arrest, I want to leave. If I am free to leave, please tell me immediately so that I my go about my business.
When you have given this to the patrolman.
How did they react?
nancy1340
03-22-2007, 03:02 AM
Well that sucks if it is true..... In NH the CCW is good for 5 years, and you really won't like this..... it costs $10.00..
By the time I get all the paper work done it will be about $100+ here.
It's not a simple renewel, send in your money thing here. You have to re-take the whole class each time. The whole thing. New photo's etc, etc.
Rafael
03-22-2007, 07:14 AM
Anne,
I didn't say the roadblocks are not wrong, I'm just saying it's stupid to argue with someone who is armed, and the roadblocks, at least in my area, are extremely effective. If the idiots who ran this country would enforce our current immigration laws and properly defend our borders then the roadblocks would not be effective and therefore they would not exist.
Txanne
03-22-2007, 07:39 AM
Anne,
I didn't say the roadblocks are not wrong, I'm just saying it's stupid to argue with someone who is armed, and the roadblocks, at least in my area, are extremely effective. If the idiots who ran this country would enforce our current immigration laws and properly defend our borders then the roadblocks would not be effective and therefore they would not exist.
Raf--totally agree.
Enforce what we got already!!!
And arguing with a cop in Tx is deadly--I can only speak for this State.
And Houston has become one of the most dangerous places to be confront by cops.
And especially if your asleep in your bed--sorry for the slight hyjack.
annie---agreeing with Raf ;D
Rafael
03-22-2007, 09:23 AM
Arguing with anybody, cop, criminal, soldier, candystriper, who is armed is a mistake, no matter where you are.
Mac_Muz
03-22-2007, 12:01 PM
Statement of Constitutional Rights *
Officer, I mean no disrespect, but I understand my rights. I have the right to have an attorney present during questioning. I have the right to refuse to consent to any search of my body, and personal effects. I wish to exercise all my rights. If I am under arrest I wish to invoke and exercise my Miranda rights and be allowed the opportunity to obtain the advise of attorney. If I am to be taken into custody I request a reasonable opportunity to make arrangements to secure my own property. I do not consent to any impoundment of my property. If I am not under arrest, I want to leave. If I am free to leave, please tell me immediately so that I my go about my business. *
When you have given this to the patrolman.
How did they react?
I hand over that on the request of my lic and reg... They take it all back to the cruiser, and with out much wasted time hand over my ticket, and give my lic and reg back with out furth aduie... They tend to keep the paper though...
Once I am just about on my way I say Thanks' officer" and leave....
Once in a while they test me to see if i will speak... I don't, and there ain't nuthin they can do about it...
Since I have more of those should I be arrested, I would pass out more...
I don't do things illegal other that speed a little bit, and not much over general traffic. I have nothing to be interested in other than maybe going to or coming back from events, when every item I have is pre 1840.
What this doesn't tell you is as a child the cops were around alot due to drunk mother and her friggin boyfriends. I got an early start seeing cops lean on folks including me from age 6 to 14 when I left for good.
At 7 I shot one of those bums with a kids bow, and was scaled by the cops for it, but the guy was beating my then 5 year old brother, and had just beaten my mother.
Many more occasions came to pass, at 12 I put a 3 speed Plymouth on top of a stone wall as I planned to do. I had escorted this drunk out of the house after he punched holes in the walls everywhere. I managed to get him in the car and put that car on the wall about 15 miles from home and left him dead drunk in the car..
he told the cops the truth, but I had learned about lying from the cops before, so I lied and told the cops "hey I'm 12 years old and don't know how to drive."
Later more bs and a guy dropped dead and in the doing fell down the stairs. He was the only one worthy of life, but none the less he was dead, and then the cops accused me of pushing him and I was up on a murder rap. That was dropped soon enough, but the damage was permanent in my head... I was 14, and left home..
By 16 messin with cops in Boston was a game, the war in Viet Nam was in full swing, and I fought cops for fun, until I got drafted...... oops!
At 55 now I still have long hair. I weigh 145 and dead of winter camp both modern and primitive. In 87 I got crushed at work and lost my job, that ended in divorce, with me broke and broken. So rather than take welfare I lived in a tee pee for 1,095 days....
I don't bother with the "American Dream" much any more and work as little as possible. I have my motor bikes and a few black power guns to play with, and few other guns if I ever have a NEED.....
So thats me in a nutshell. I can be a good friend but I make a challenging enemy.... You get to choose.... I take my folks as I find em and don't pigeon hole them first.
Mac_Muz
03-22-2007, 12:16 PM
I thought Texas was all about Freedom.... I rode across Texas with no problem on my bike from almost El Paso to Jasper and on into LA....
Now that Jasper ain't a rich place to be. I think I'll avoid that town if I get a next time..... I was pretty happy to have my 45 there.... I was really happy I had it on Pine Ridge for my little stay there too.. No one ever saw it of course, I have no intent to show off...
Well I can't say that no one ever did, as when I hit invites many of the guys were interested in simply seeing it... Kimber CDP II. I bought that to retire a WW-2 vintage Remington Rand I bought years ago for a song, and that one evidently is getting collector status...
In NH there is no pic ID or even a finger print on the CCW, just a text discription and a end date..
I have one from Mass with my pic as in 1978 LOL, but I keep it because that cop who issued it to me blew his own brains out, and it reminds me how useless these papers are.....
Here either you are based on convictions, and I have none. So with no convictions for felony I am good to go.... No classes, no nuthing....
My dad gave me a .22 at 6, and I have been around enough to build flintlocks from shop junk making barrels, locks and stocks by hand from time to time with very little store bought brass castings...
nancy1340
03-22-2007, 12:25 PM
Mac, sounds like you ought to write a book.
I'd buy it.
Mac_Muz
03-22-2007, 12:32 PM
Folks tell me that all the time.... ::) So I am on the ride coast to coast to coast.. My wife was with me on the Nomad and we had a little bike trailer I made from a harbor freight kit. On that we had in big letters made of tapes "Clueless and Lark" We called it Expedition Re- Duh
nancy1340
03-22-2007, 12:45 PM
LOL LOL
Bad_Omen
03-22-2007, 12:49 PM
How weird is this?
I was reading this very post earlier today when there was a knock upon my door. Having spent the morning working hard on a website up I sprang in desperate need of a diversion. Now for last few weeks I've been waiting on a knife I ordered from the States(the second since Nov 06, the first still hasn't arrived), so the postman is always welcome as he may well be baring gifts. You may have noticed that I'm the eternal optimist, sad but true.
Anyway, I digress. I was to be disappointed, there was no postie on my doorstep and certainly no bloody presents. What there was turned out to be two gendarmes(cops, for those who don't parlay Francaise).
For once I was in the clear, they were looking for a woman, no problem I thought. I called Charlie, my wife, but they didn't want her either. Blast!
Turns out some French woman had done something and given my address. They were cool about it and there was no big problem...
Until they asked for our ID. It was at this point we had a bit of a falling out. My way of looking at it was : you have a picture of your suspect. It matches neither me nor my wife. Why do I need to show you ID in my own home? His explanation that it was so if anyone asked him to find me a serve a warrant just made me laugh even harder.
I've got to say I was almost speechless, I was under the impression the Nazis had pulled out of France a while ago.
nancy1340
03-22-2007, 12:55 PM
B.O. WHAT?!?!? ::)
Did you have a hard time not laughing?
Bad_Omen
03-22-2007, 01:21 PM
A VERY hard time. to make matters worse was it was the classic 'good cop, bad cop' situation.
There was one young'un and one older cop. The older one was determined to be arsey and I could tell the younger one was embarrassed by it all. As I was showing them the door the younger chap asked me about my dog. He's an Japanese Akita Inu, so fairly rare( only 39 in the UK, don't know the numbers)in France, so he gets a lot of comments/questions. So I'm telling the guy what hes is and all that when the 'bad' cop decides to try and annoy me further. 'well, you know he needs a tattoo and a rabies shot and you can't walk him with out a lead'. '
Really officer? I wasn't aware of that. Hang on a moment, heres his passport, his microchip number, his kennel club registration. And yes when in public he's lead is always on.'
I'm 34 for God's sake, the last thing I need is a lecture from a cop about responsible dog ownership, especially since it was only done to try and get the last word in.
Laugh, I nearly cried.
Txanne
03-22-2007, 03:00 PM
Mac, sounds like you ought to write a book.
I'd buy it.
Me too--Very interesting--but I'd like Nancy to Co-author.
The lady has ridden a mile or 2 herself!!
Tougher than a 3 day old taco--But has a heart of gold!! ;D
annie
nancy1340
03-22-2007, 03:18 PM
;D
I like tacos.
Mac_Muz
03-23-2007, 07:10 AM
Ok wi$e a$$, $end dollar$ and nancy and me will go for a long ride. I know where Texa$ is $o long a$ no one moved it recently. ;D
I like taco$ too :P
Txanne
03-23-2007, 07:43 AM
Noone would dare move Texas---and tacos we got---ride your self down here----and btw--I have no money for others fun rides!!!!! ;D
If I aint flying---I aint buying!!
But have rode 2nd up a couple of times!! ;D
annie---
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