Make gas for 12 cents a gallon?

[winter_unfazed]

I have been seeing ads lately that advertise a book telling you how to turn corn into gas for $0.12/gallon. Do any of you have this book? I wondered if you have to alter the engine to make it a flex fuel engine first.

[fredusa]

Haven't seen the book, nor the advertisement. The only fuel I know of that one can produce w/corn would be ethanol, and should not be referred to as gas nor gasoline. About the only plant that I know of which can be turned into gasoline is the creosote plant which grows wild in the gerat American Southwest, but attempts to domesticate it have, thus far, been unsuccessful.
Yes, I'd bet that if you can grow your own corn that you could produce a burnable alcohol for your car for $0.12. But this stuff doesn't ignite very well when cold, and in the old days ('60s and '70s) those using such a system used two fuel tanks and a valve. One tank held pump gasoline, the other the alcohol. They'd start their vehicles on gasoline, then, when it warmed up a bit they'd switch over to the alcohol.
Hope this helps.

[dannanchieftain]

I have been experimenting with this lately and actually made some with sugar. I dont see how they can claim 12 cents a gallon. From a 5 gallon batch I only got about *5 quarts of 180 proof ethanol.

An acre of corn will produce about 350 gallons of ethanol but you have to use energy to convert it.

Running ethanol in cars can be and has been done if its an older car the floats and jets have to be altered because ethanol is lighter and leaner than gas. Cold weather starting as mentioned is also a factor some say you need to prime with gasoline before you can run ethanol in cold weather.

Fuel injected vehicles have to be a flex fuel type so that the fuel system is calibrated to run on ethanol but they still wont run 100% ethanol. They still require a mix of 15% gasoline.

I am still hopeful that somehow this technology will be developed and become cost effective. From my own experiments though I cant see how it can be cost effective

Bio-Diesel is actually looking to be more cost effective. It is fuel made from vegtable and other oils. however it only works in diesel engines

[fredusa]

I don't doubt the possibility of $0.12/gallon, but it does require the use of a renewable energy such as solar. To use a fossil fuel or grid electric, or the like, to produce the heat to produce the alcohol would raise that figure considerably, I'm sure.
And, indeed, biodeisel seems a better alternative simply because the diesel engine is so much more efficient.

[ryanmercer]

Being in a state (Indiana) that is about to be the largest producer of Ethanol in North America... I have to say it's NOT as cheap as that book claims, as a matter of fact to get the same mpg it's going to cost you more than the 2.08 a gallon gas was here today... Not to mention very very very few engines will burn straight ethanol, sure all IRL cars will be burning only ethanol starting next year... but most consumer cars on the market right now can only burn a very very diluted mix. There ARE lots of vehicles coming out that will burn E85 (85% ethanol, 15% gasoline by volume) but for the most part only new automobiles will even burn E85. There are only 17 u.s. market automobiles that can currently burn E85 ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E85#Current_E85_flexible-fuel_cars ). *nods*

[Smoky]

"From a 5 gallon batch I only got about 5 quarts of 180 proof ethanol."
Dannancheiftain: OK, I'll bite, how do you get that yeild?

[pancho]

Ground has been broken for a large ethanol plant in Ms. Cost is estimated at $100 million. When completed it will produce 60 million gallons of ethanol per year.

The problem will be there isn't enough corn grown in Ms. now without importing from other states. The only way this new plant will be able to compete with gasoline is because the plant will be built on the Ms. river and barges can be used to bring the grain in and the high price of gas. Many places the transportation cost of enough corn will make the price very high.

[ryanmercer]

Ground has been broken for a large ethanol plant in Ms. Cost is estimated at $100 million. When completed it will produce 60 million gallons of ethanol per year.

The problem will be there isn't enough corn grown in Ms. now without importing from other states. The only way this new plant will be able to compete with gasoline is because the plant will be built on the Ms. river and barges can be used to bring the grain in and the high price of gas. Many places the transportation cost of enough corn will make the price very high.


Indiana, my state, will soon be the largest producer... but guess what are major crop is... corn... guess our 2nd major crop... Soybeans... heh.

[pancho]

Wonder what this will do to the price of corn? It will have to increase when several of the plants come on line. Good for some and not so good for others.

[JakeLeg]

Wonder what this will do to the price of corn? It will have to increase when several of the plants come on line. Good for some and not so good for others.

true.

another thing to think about is what it's going to do to the environment. corn is an extremely hungry plant that depletes most of the value from the soil. this is why many of us who grow organically must rotate our corn. growing corn on a massive scale to use as fuel is only going to increase the need to use chemical fertilizers which is not a good thing.

[ryanmercer]

true.

another thing to think about is what it's going to do to the environment. corn is an extremely hungry plant that depletes most of the value from the soil. this is why many of us who grow organically must rotate our corn. growing corn on a massive scale to use as fuel is only going to increase the need to use chemical fertilizers which is not a good thing.


Soy likes to replenish the soil corn grew in... that's why corn and soy are our two big crops here in Indiana. But the simple fact is, everyone things "oh biodiesel yeah lets use that!" If you took every available piece of farm land in the united states, grew the best crop for biodisel, you STILL couldn't produce enough fuel for the entire country... so it isn't an answer at all, it's a waste of time unless we make insanely efficient engines.

[dannanchieftain]

For those that have asked about my ethanol experiments.

I built a double reflux column still with a thumper and I started out with a wash consisting of:

14lbs of sugar
enough water to make a 5 gallon
48hr turbo yeast
4 tablespoons of b100 enzyme.

after 3 days I tested it and it registered about 24% alchohol.

I put it all in the still and started up the propane burner
when it started to run I put the first half pint back into the "thumper keg" and when it ran again I started to collect. Watching the thermometer when the temp started to rise above 175 deg. I started to shut it down and I was left with 4 full qt jars and one qt jar that was almost full.

I tested it with an alchohol meter after it cooled and my test samples between the jars was between 175 and 185 proof.

I am by no means an expert on the subject but if you add up the costs of the materials and the propane used to extract the alchohol,the cost is way more than .12 cents a gallon.

I have only been at this for a few months perhaps i will learn an easier way but not likely. I have tried cracked corn from a feed store using distillers yeast and I seem to get less of a yeild and its less potent, besides the smell when distilling corn mash is horrible and after distilling there is this nasty stuff called fusil oils that has to be filtered out to make the ethanol pure. And like I said the end product is less potent than the sugar product. I have tried it out with a 2.5 briggs engine and it wont run on anything less than 180 proof.

[unclesam]

Dont worry about removing the fusil oils they will burn fine, you just dont want to drink those.

By the way for anyone experimenting w/this I would recomend that you get the $5.00 tax stamp from ATF for an experimental/home use alchohol fuel still. As you know those government boys are sticklers for the details,and if you get caught with an unlicensed still it is a federal crime.

I have done a little research on this subject and one thing I found out is that jerusalem artichokes are extremely well suited to alchohol fuel production.They are cheap to grow,heavy yielding, drought tolerant and have a high yield of alchohol for a given amount ofcrop.

[flatwater]

Personnaly this is all to cornfusing to me, I mean gas from corn, that even sounds a little corny. I do have to cornfess that I too would like to see a cheaper method of fueling my truck, have they ever corncidered going back to the stanly steamer type engine? If you can cornvince me that corn makes a better fuel then it does moon shine then I would just have to cornvert to it.

[ffd430]

its only $5.00 for the permt for an experimental still? wow, the book that I have (published in the 80s) states that it cost thounands... I'm kickin the Wifes car outa the garage this weekend, I've got some welding to do... Oh do you still have to mix it with gas so you can't drink it?