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  #121  
Old 04-30-2014, 11:10 PM
Sacalait50 Male Sacalait50 is offline
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Originally Posted by Dennis G View Post
I have enjoyed this thread...but guys, it is all about placement.

If you can hit the right part, a 22LR will kill a person...

If you are firing a 45 and have fewer bullets than I do because I carry a 9mm,

AND

If I can hit three inch circles consistently at ten yards and 5 inch circles at 25 yards,

AND

You cannot...

then a rational betting person would bet on me.

I would rather have 32 rounds of 9mm in an XD 9 (with one spare mag) then half that amount of 45 ACP in a 1911...

I know the arguments about adrenalin and tunnel vision and all that... but I still think it is about the ability to place your shots into the right places...

three hits in the heart and lungs with my 9mm is enough... or one in the brain...and I have plenty of shots.

if you have a 45 or a bazooka and cannot hit anything I win the test.

For me, I like the 9 because with just one spare magazine I can put a lot of rounds into bad guy(s).

JUST my two cents worth.

Dennis G
Dennis, I'm with you 100 %.

I don't know how many active or retired LE are on the forum, who have worked shootings/homicides, but 95% of my shootings were NOT with JHPs . I have worked plenty, but the shooters were mostly thugs, drug related and domestic offenses, armed robberies etc. Domestic shootings over females or males, property, money etc. Handguns from .22 shorts to .45 . They obtained the cheapest ammo available.

I attended all the autopsies and the pathologist would always point out where the bullet (s) traveled and organs damaged, in which I photographed and collected evidence from the body.

Having said that, I carry JHPs in all my handguns. I want to cause as much damage to the body if I shoot someone. I also carry and prefer the 9mm. My intentions, if the situation occurs where I have to use my handgun, is to fire as many rounds into the subject that I can, more holes, more blood lost .

Last edited by Sacalait50; 04-30-2014 at 11:51 PM.
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  #122  
Old 05-01-2014, 01:39 AM
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tgp7799 Male tgp7799 is offline
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Here is some testing I did a few years back. Fired from a XD45C at 21 feet through 3 layers of denim into two frozen gallon milk jugs of water and a third one of slush to collect the bullets. The first 2 on the left is standard FMJ the 3rd. is a generic HP the 4th is a Winchester Ranger ( same as the Black Talon) and the last 2 are Federal Hydro Shock. For my carry ammo I carry the Winchester Rangers.

http://i60.tinypic.com/21lqv61.jpg
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  #123  
Old 05-01-2014, 03:22 AM
Sacalait50 Male Sacalait50 is offline
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Originally Posted by tgp7799 View Post
Here is some testing I did a few years back. Fired from a XD45C at 21 feet through 3 layers of denim into two frozen gallon milk jugs of water and a third one of slush to collect the bullets. The first 2 on the left is standard FMJ the 3rd. is a generic HP the 4th is a Winchester Ranger ( same as the Black Talon) and the last 2 are Federal Hydro Shock. For my carry ammo I carry the Winchester Rangers.

http://i60.tinypic.com/21lqv61.jpg
I prefer the 45 acp Winchester Ranger over the Hydro Shock, though both are excellent rounds. I carry the Winchester Ranger and Hornady Critical Duty in my 9's. I stopped carrying 45's years ago (Colt 1911 Series 70) when we could carry anything. We switched over from revolvers (S&W model 66) to S&W 5906 then to S&W 4046. I always changed the grips on the S&W to the straight or flat grip that resembled the 1911. The Glock just did not feel right, plus I did not like the stricker system. I have two S&W 5943, a Kahr CW9 and a Ruger P89 . I only have one .40, the 4046. I'm partial to S&W models because of the double action only and the magazine safety. I guess I'm old school revolver and like the similar trigger pull on the pistols. My main carry is a S&W 642 with the Gold Dot 38 special for snubbies, since I retired .

The XD45 are excellent pistols . I thought serious about the XD9 or the Sig 226, but I really don't need another gun---lol

I forgot to add, I have witnessed the affect of the 45 acp Hydro Shock, police shootings, with Sig 220's, the autopsies were impressive.

Last edited by Sacalait50; 05-01-2014 at 03:37 AM.
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  #124  
Old 05-01-2014, 10:00 PM
Kachad Male Kachad is offline
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The Winchester ranger expansion just looks plain mean. Thank you two last posters for the observations and info.
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  #125  
Old 05-02-2014, 12:16 AM
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Quote:
The Winchester ranger expansion just looks plain mean
They were so "mean" they took them off the market

But that's when they had a black outer coating and were called
"Black Talons"

They removed the coating and renamed them "Ranger"


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  #126  
Old 05-02-2014, 01:21 AM
Sacalait50 Male Sacalait50 is offline
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Originally Posted by Bearfootfarm View Post
They were so "mean" they took them off the market

But that's when they had a black outer coating and were called
"Black Talons"

They removed the coating and renamed them "Ranger"


No more black bullets nor black silhouette targets, only green and blue ???
We have to be politically correct or something. LOL
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  #127  
Old 05-02-2014, 09:35 PM
Kachad Male Kachad is offline
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Originally Posted by Sacalait50 View Post
No more black bullets nor black silhouette targets, only green and blue ???
We have to be politically correct or something. LOL
What about the Andorians and Bolians? They are green and blue, we must not profile or have targets in those colors either .....
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  #128  
Old 05-08-2014, 09:14 AM
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randallhilton Male randallhilton is offline
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Default Shot through the heart

About 6 weeks - 2 months ago we carried in a feller who had been shot through the heart and right lung with a single 9mm FMJ. It tore a hole in his right ventricle and atrium if you know anything about the heart.

The last I heard, he's working his way through re-hab and will be able to tell the story.

That being said, I hear that medical examiners see more 9mm and .380 gsw's on their table than any other round. I figure that's because there are so many people using those rounds.

Personally, I carry Rangers because I found several boxes at a good price and I carry .40sw because cops around here seem to like them. Not very scientific.

I practice with the Dot Torture routine with pretty good results on paper.

In a real situation. . . I truly hope the training kicks in.
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