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  #21  
Old 07-04-2015, 08:02 PM
jvcstone jvcstone is offline
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I suppose you could say that, except eliminating the wage cap would not necessarily increase the with holding tax rate--in fact could lower it and still increase funding.

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  #22  
Old 07-04-2015, 08:45 PM
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I suppose you could say that, except eliminating the wage cap would not necessarily increase the with holding tax rate--in fact could lower it and still increase funding.

JVC
I never discussed rates- merely increasing deduction by what ever means. If people want thier SS benifits then pay for them.

I will say doing away with the cap and not adjusting the rate to some type of a sliding scale makes it more of a progressive tax than ever- a great progressive liberal idea. That is what we continually hear from the left - making the rich pay " thier fair share".
Bunch of liberal crap just like means testing.
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  #23  
Old 07-05-2015, 02:14 PM
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One would think that Congress is elected to SOLVE problems, but once elected they conspire to CREATE problems to ensure their re-election.

I've said this here before: after making allowances for a transition period (because those at or near retirement don't have the luxury of time on their sides) a new SS system would maintain accounts for each individual. A, say, $20 tax would be paid each month from birth to age 18 (appropriate subsidies could be made for the disadvantaged). The money would be invested in a mutual fund tied to, say, the Dow.

If the historical trend is maintained, each account would be worth ~$6.5 miliion at age 65. Just a little bit better than the puny $0.5 million or less that most of us now would receive IF we were lucky enough to live to age 85.

At time of death, any money left over in the account could be passed on to heirs. The biggest problem I see with this system is that of inflation caused by so much wealth being created.

But like I said, they don't WANT to solve the problem.
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  #24  
Old 07-05-2015, 03:38 PM
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One would think that Congress is elected to SOLVE problems, but once elected they conspire to CREATE problems to ensure their re-election.

I've said this here before: after making allowances for a transition period (because those at or near retirement don't have the luxury of time on their sides) a new SS system would maintain accounts for each individual. A, say, $20 tax would be paid each month from birth to age 18 (appropriate subsidies could be made for the disadvantaged). The money would be invested in a mutual fund tied to, say, the Dow.

If the historical trend is maintained, each account would be worth ~$6.5 miliion at age 65. Just a little bit better than the puny $0.5 million or less that most of us now would receive IF we were lucky enough to live to age 85.

At time of death, any money left over in the account could be passed on to heirs. The biggest problem I see with this system is that of inflation caused by so much wealth being created.

But like I said, they don't WANT to solve the problem.
Great point . The reason they don't want to make long term solution is the citizens in the transition THAT VOTE.. Something along lines of you proposal is possible but I would suggest a better idea is for people to take care of thier own responsibilities instead of relying on a nanny state to do thier thinking. And provide a tax deduction for the investment.
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  #25  
Old 07-05-2015, 06:45 PM
Doninalaska Doninalaska is offline
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A number of older people are continuing to work because they dont feel they have the option to retire at this time.
And SS is paying out more then is coming in. More and more Baby Boomers are retiring, but there is not enough coming in to cover those payments. The younger generations are not in the high paying jobs, but lower paying jobs. Many are putting off life milestones due to lack of well paying jobs.





Was it not Warren Buffet who commented on how he paid less in taxes than his secretary?

I think it is more like a socialist oligarchy.

More and more folks are being added to the SS roles who have never contributed anything to SS, such as elderly illegal immigrants, and legal immigrants, for that matter. Although that doesn't matter as to the amount paid in since the "lockbox" has been gone since the Johnson Administration, it does increase the financial strain on the system.

Warren Buffet commented that he was paying a lower RATE than his secretary, all the while fighting a multi-billion dollar IRS assessment in the courts--the height of hypocrisy. Listen to all those adds on TV and radio that offer to help you negotiate if you owe $10,000 or more in taxes. The smaller guys get screwed while the folks who don't pay taxes--like the first Treasury Secretary for Obama--owe thousands and get away with paying a few hundred.

Doc's comment on the retirement age is also appropriate. Allowing opportunity for younger workers is the original reason that some of the national retirement ages were set so low after WWII. When I lived in Japan, the retirement age was 55 (I don't know if that is still true). When I asked why, I was told it was to allow younger workers with children to climb the career ladder and better support their families. Some older workers had jobs to supplement their incomes in retirement. I knew older ladies who had "baby-bathing" services. The older ladies made daily rounds to bathe infants and small children. It gave the moms a break and allowed them to get shopping and such done, and the older ladies were given a stipend by each family to supplement their income. It seemed to work quite well for everybody involved. Wyo and some others seem to do a bit of volunteer work, and accomplish social good while filling their days.
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  #26  
Old 07-05-2015, 09:46 PM
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Majority of Countries have a retirement age of 60 or older including Greece.

This Link gives the age only three have retirement ages under 60 for men. 19 others have it lower for woman.

I see the issue is woman are allowed to retire before a man yet lives longer so cost more. Raise the age for woman to retire.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Retirement_age
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  #27  
Old 07-05-2015, 11:45 PM
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Majority of Countries have a retirement age of 60 or older including Greece.

This Link gives the age only three have retirement ages under 60 for men. 19 others have it lower for woman.

I see the issue is woman are allowed to retire before a man yet lives longer so cost more. Raise the age for woman to retire.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Retirement_age
In Greece the retirement age became 67 in 2015, but it was 57 in 2009 and has only recently went up.

Refer the comments on taxes. You folks need to stop believing internet hype.
The fact is the top 10% of income earners pay over 60% of Americas taxes. Period.

Concerning who gets SS to bunch baloney there to even comment on . Most is Internet myth with no truth. For example illegal immigrants get no benifits even though they pay. .

Let's no forget that SS IS not and was never designed to or intended to be a retirement plan.
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  #28  
Old 07-06-2015, 11:57 AM
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Great point . The reason they don't want to make long term solution is the citizens in the transition THAT VOTE.. Something along lines of you proposal is possible but I would suggest a better idea is for people to take care of thier own responsibilities instead of relying on a nanny state to do thier thinking. And provide a tax deduction for the investment.
Even tho I hate govt intervention in our lives, we've got to face reality: most people don't have the sense of responsibility to do what it takes unless forced to. Under the current system, a taxpayer shells out close to $10Gs a year over 40 yrs and gets back only $1/2 million. But by putting in just $240 a yr for 18 yrs (total of only $4300) for each kid, too young to protect themselves, we take advantage of interest compounded over 65 yrs to get a pay-off in the $millions. We could be doing the same for healthcare financing, or have the program cover both.
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  #29  
Old 07-06-2015, 02:05 PM
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H
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Even tho I hate govt intervention in our lives, we've got to face reality: most people don't have the sense of responsibility to do what it takes unless forced to. Under the current system, a taxpayer shells out close to $10Gs a year over 40 yrs and gets back only $1/2 million. But by putting in just $240 a yr for 18 yrs (total of only $4300) for each kid, too young to protect themselves, we take advantage of interest compounded over 65 yrs to get a pay-off in the $millions. We could be doing the same for healthcare financing, or have the program cover both.
But Doc the reason they do that is because the have come to be " RELIANT " on nanny Govt to take care them rather than get off their duff and take care of themselves.

That is what you say the problem is in the welfare system yet in that case you say cut em off .

Can't have it both ways. They must be weaned off if that nanny state belief in both cases.
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  #30  
Old 07-08-2015, 12:59 PM
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Back to Greece and thier debt problem and false comparisons to America .
Don't forget we have over $ 300 trillion ( at today's market price) in gold reserves.

When you decide if you are broke or not you count all you assets against all your liabilities - regardless of how you manage your budget.

America is not broke !
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  #31  
Old 07-08-2015, 04:02 PM
jvcstone jvcstone is offline
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Don't forget we have over $ 300 trillion ( at today's market price) in gold reserves.
Your sure of that??? Even a past mint director has trouble keeping his stories straight when it comes to what kind of gold is stored and audit procedures at the Ft. Knox deep storage facility

https://www.bullionstar.com/blogs/ko...-in-fort-knox/

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  #32  
Old 07-08-2015, 04:17 PM
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Your sure of that??? Even a past mint director has trouble keeping his stories straight when it comes to what kind of gold is stored and audit procedures at the Ft. Knox deep storage facility

https://www.bullionstar.com/blogs/ko...-in-fort-knox/

JVC
. Read you article carefully and you see there is no quibbling over how much ONlY the guys claims to have seen the gold. Anything questioning how much is Internet drivel.

I saw that article this morning also. It is what got me to thinking about the value of our reserve. I also founded put that when China quotes its gold reserve it counts " in ground reserve" which they have 1900 tons.
If we were to count ours - another 3000 tons- we would have an additional $100 trillion in reserve at market price.
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  #33  
Old 07-08-2015, 04:32 PM
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While everyone is watching Greece, China seems to be going to H---. Over 200 companies have suspended trading on the Shanghai market, and the market has lost 30% of its value in recent days. Technical glitches today at NYSE, WSJ, and United Airlines. Is there a connection? Homeland says no....

http://www.latimes.com/business/tech...708-story.html
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  #34  
Old 07-08-2015, 05:17 PM
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No no connection . China is in trouble for basically the same reason we were in 2007/08-- investing with borrowed money - leveraging or direviatives. It works when economy is growing but soon as chinas economy slowed trouble started. Chinese govt used to have strict regulations against that but they were relaxed . Remind you of anything- glass steigle (sp)

Ref airline computer Glich - now over. It is amazing that when something happens we immediately suspect an end of the world connection.
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  #35  
Old 07-15-2015, 12:42 PM
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No no connection . China is in trouble for basically the same reason we were in 2007/08-- investing with borrowed money - leveraging or direviatives. It works when economy is growing but soon as chinas economy slowed trouble started. Chinese govt used to have strict regulations against that but they were relaxed . Remind you of anything- glass steigle (sp)

Ref airline computer Glich - now over. It is amazing that when something happens we immediately suspect an end of the world connection.
Glass-Steagall - Phil Gramm's life goal was to repeal it. I remember all the emails I got at work telling me how great repealing this law would be. Uh yeah, not so great.

Greece suffers from the same problem as the US - those who got them into the mess, banks and politicians, will suffer no consequences.

The underground economy will kick into high gear, just like in the US. Truth be told, I think the US might be in more trouble than Greece. Look at the debt load of the average American. How many people in the US live paycheck to paycheck - I'm not talking minimum wage workers.

Millennials have little appetite to own homes or cars - the lynchpin of consumer spending. There has been an uptick in Millennials pooling money to buy property. But it is driven by out of control rent, not the american dream of owning a home.
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  #36  
Old 07-15-2015, 01:49 PM
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Just as a note of reference for everyone that worries about Chinese or Greece impact on us .
China's stock market is somewhere around 10. % of the economy . Top of that. Well over 98% of the investors are Chinese - virtually no foreign investment. Means nothing to us.
Greece total economy is .(point) 38 % of world economy .
Once again no impact on us .

Btw I add again America is not broke with 300 trillion setting in gold reserves .
Think about it. How many people have money in the bank but still borrow to buy a car. Assets versus liabilities.

Maybe you all see if different than I but to me Greece is borrowing money cause the have to to survive we do cause that the way we like it.
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  #37  
Old 07-16-2015, 09:59 AM
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Gold reserves mean nothing. Gold has no intrinsic value. It is merely an arbitrarily agreed upon medium of exchange. If we go broke, who will we "sell" our gold to? What will they use to pay for it? Look at Russia- they have loads of gold, but there's only so much vodka the rest of the world can drink.

A country's wealth is measured by its GDP- the value of all its goods and services. Our national debt exceeds our GDP by a few hundred Billion $, and the gap is widening. While we are not "broke" yet, the trend is in that direction.

To get out of a deep hole, one must first stop digging it deeper.

BTW- Greek youth were rioting over night in protest of proposed austerity measures. As we've said before: the most likely SHTF scenario here will occur when the welfare checks stop coming in the mail.
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  #38  
Old 07-16-2015, 10:46 AM
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I disagree . The very fact that it is there means more than anything. And yea we could sell it if we want . Heck just recently people here were worried about China buying gold. There is indeed a world market for gold . And while we don't have the world "'gold " on our money the world knows we have it.

Ref Greece. Thier parliament approved the plan. Doe it now go to the voters or is that it. ?( assuming Germany approves the plan)
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