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REMINDER — 22 Comments

  1. Gun Control (aka civilian disarmament) advocates don’t have the facts on their side very often, if at all, so they have to make stuff up all the time. Their idea of ‘common sense’ is anything but … and they are extremely uneducated in things having to do with firearms and justifiable use of deadly force.

    And too many forget that the operative word in gun control is ‘control’. Myriad comments from the democrats and democratic socialists make it clear that if they had their way, they’d not hesitate to use force to make people adopt their radical agendas whether they wanted to or not.

  2. All one needs to do is put themselves in Mr. Zimmeran’s shoes and it becomes clear that is was and is self defense. I needn’t “Like” George Zimmerman to acknowledge that he was in jeopardy of having his head bashed in by a thug who had the means and proximity.

  3. The simple truth is that Trayvon Martin is dead because his Pappy never taught him to respect other people or their stuff. End of story. ALL the details I’ve ever seen concerning this piece of work Traybon Martin point in that direction.
    Ome interesting “factoid” I’ve never seen in the Snews is that, a short time prior to this incident, the “angelic choirboy” had been accosted for other cause and fund to have specific items stolen from some as yet unsolved housebreakings…. IN the area where he met his end. Further, once he was removed from the criminal pool, the housebreakings in that development seem to have mysteriously come to a sudden end. Now SOME might posit that it was because of all the publicity. I tend to think it is simply because, thanks to George Zimmerman’s vigilance and respnsible action, the perpetrator of thse multiple housebreakings has been occupied doing something else…. chucking up daisies. Meanwhile, his “parting shot” has become the ruination of George ZImmerman’s life. So HE remains the real victim while the dead sleeps on, unaffected.

  4. Black Lives Matter and the media have continued to perpetuate the lies. Honestly, the result is obvious to anyone reading the transcripts, but why bother with the facts.

  5. Yesterday there was a “Trayvon memorial march” with his parents pontificating on the unfairness of it all. The “news” media was all over it. They refuse to acknowledge the reality of that situation. Made me want to scream!

  6. I wonder if any of the media or other pundits ever face the same thing will they feel any different during the time they are getting their heads bashed against the curb.

  7. Most deaths are sad. A prick like George was/is a bully who flaunted his gun rights & took a young man’s life. The outcome could have been much different if George weren’t out looking for trouble.

    • If you think about it, Jon, being the duly elected head of Community Watch — which the evidence shows George absolutely was — means looking for trouble.
      You don’t sound fully informed on this particular issue. You might want to read the blog series I linked in this post, and get back to us.

      • Mas, I used to volunteer doing much the same thing a few years ago in AZ. I was always armed (usually M&P .40c plus pepper spray and a proper light plus of course cell phone)) and trained in the lawful use of all the above. I also did a college paper on the facts of the case here which showed that without any doubt George Zimmerman was right in his actions from the beginning. I never forgot the lessons from it all, and I deeply appreciate all the work you have done so that we all may learn.

  8. Hmm. While it is true and everything Mas and the courts proved and decided is indisputable, I have a different take on this incredible case. As a lawfully Armed Citizen who is licensed to teach applicants for their CCW, to include law enforcement up to the federal level, the one thing I teach my civilian students is avoid conflict at all times. De-escalate, de-escalate, de-escalate. Never engage, unless engaged. And therein lies the problem.

    From the classes I have taken, MAG-40, repeated MAG-40 to MAG-80, and many other professionally taught Armed Citizen training, it has been ingrained into my way of thinking that unless a crime against the Armed Citizen or family or reliable friends is imminent, that citizen is to act as the perfect witness of a crime in progress or is about to happen. From a distance. It has been drilled into my head that, I do not have a right to pursue someone based on suspicion, ESPECIALLY when armed.

    Here’s the conundrum and I am sure some will despise me for my opinion, but it’s my opinion, nothing more: given the nature of Zimmerman, pacifist, SJW-he voted for Obama, correct? and his overall lack of physique and for the most part raised as a mama’s boy/effeminate nature, I would conclude he would have not gotten out of his vehicle that fateful night, to pursue a much bigger person, in a darkened shadow from the building on a rainy night unless he was armed.

    In the Ten Commandments Of Conceal Carry by Massad Ayoob, III Don’t let the gun make you reckless {your gun should reduce your risks, not increase them}

    It is in my opinion, had George Zimmerman never exited his vehicle, we would have never heard of him or the other guy. Remember, carrying a gun should REDUCE your risk, not increase them. Zimmerman put the gears in motion, everything else is up to the court of law

    Stay safe.

    • Larry, you’re right that if he never exited his vehicle, the confrontation likely would not have happened. However, he had accepted the responsibility as elected captain of neighborhood watch; when the dispatcher asked him where the person we now know to have been Trayvon Martin went, it was logical that Zimmerman would respond by getting out of his vehicle to look.

    • I doubt that Zimmerman would have left his truck had the dispatcher not asked him where Martin had gone. The dispatcher, quite inadvertently, set him up for Martin. As soon as the dispatcher realized Zimmerman was outside and trying to find Martin, he discouraged from continuing. By then, it was too late. Martin jumped Zimmerman before he could get back to his truck.

      Zimmerman’s flaw was that he was tactically naive. Someone more knowledgeable would have told the dispatcher, “I can’t help you. I won’t leave my truck.” Although it doesn’t make you invulnerable, being inside a vehicle, with the doors locked and the windows up, means that, to get at you, the bad guys have to leave evidence which will support your claim of self defense.

      I never hear anyone speculate what would have happened to Martin had Zimmerman not been armed. Since he lived in the neighborhood, he would have been found quickly even if he was no longer at the scene when police arrived. Depending on whether Zimmerman survived, Martin would have been convicted of aggravated assault or voluntary manslaughter and sentenced to prison. Instead of a cause celebre, he would be just a statistic.

      Andrew Branca advises having a less-than-deadly means of defense in addition to a deadly one. I once read a comment that had Zimmerman been carrying pepper spray, in addition to a handgun, his confrontation with Martin would have been local news at most.

    • One can always play “What If” guessing games with historical events. For example, if the FN-Brand pistol used by Garrilo Princip had jammed on June 28th, 1914, it is likely that the entire course of 20th Century History would have been changed. Unfortunately, it was a high-quality handgun designed by John Browning so it worked perfectly to kick off the start of WW I.

      For that matter, one could argue that, if John Browning had been satisfied with selling his designs to American manufacturers (Winchester, Colt, Remington, etc.) and never peddled his designs to an European Firearms Company (FN in Belgium), then the entire History of the 20th Century might have still been changed. Maybe not. Maybe WW I would have been kicked off with a Mauser pistol?

      It is pointless to play such games. George Zimmerman’s actions to exit his vehicle and monitor the movements of a suspicious person might be judged tactically questionable but they were entirely legal. Therefore, no blame can (or should be) assigned to George Zimmerman because of any unforeseen consequences resulting from these actions.

      • Not to engage in “victim blaming”, but what if Archduke Franz Ferdinand weren’t so vain that his uniform had functional buttons instead of him being sewn into it (to remove the appearance of seams)?

        Then doctors on-site could have removed his clothing and administered more effective first aid WITHOUT cutting it off — which they could not because they had no scissors readily available — possibly saving his life.

        I agree it is pointless to play such games. We can’t go back and change events; we must deal with them as they are. The reality is, the start of WWI was precipitated by a “perfect storm” of unfortunate events, as was the confrontation and resulting death of Trayvon Martin. Statistically those “perfect storms” don’t happen often, but they do happen.

  9. “I wonder if any of the media or other pundits ever face the same thing will they feel any different during the time they are getting their heads bashed against the curb.”

    An old adage says that the definition of a conservative is a liberal who’s been mugged.

  10. When the feds declined to pursue federal charges against Zimmerman (2 years after the shooting), all of our Democrat-controlled “news” services used it as an opportunity to repeat every piece of pre-trial misinformation about the case as fact. I ran a careful tally of the media malfeasance here:

    http://errortheory.blogspot.com/2015/07/media-still-claiming-that-trayvon.html?m=1

    The biggest media lie is named in my post title:

    “Media still claiming that Trayvon Martin was shot while walking home from 7-Eleven but key revelation from trial was that Martin ran home first, then went back out, angry at “creepy ass cracka”

  11. It’s unfortunate how the major “news” outlets get it so wrong so often adding drama and sensationalized hype as though competing for rack space beside the National Inquirer.
    So glad to have an outlet of trusted factual analysis. Thank you Mr. Ayoob.

  12. I think the more important thing over all, is not to Monday morning quarterback, but to remove from mantra “A good shoot is a good shot.” Here as in Ferguson we saw the truth twisted like taffy in order to fit a political template.

  13. Different people find different lessons in incidents like this one. The lesson for me is to leave policing to the police or more specifically DO NOT join a neighborhood watch group. Yes, there can be all sorts of guidelines on how neighborhood watch people conduct themselves.

    But this situation illustrates how easy it is to get into direct confrontation with the bad guys. In this case as simple as getting out of the vehicle to look at street signs.

    I understand the condo association was sued and I gather George was provided no support in his trial by the condo association. Talk about used and discarded. I know the police love neighborhood watch association for the public relations aspects, but they have to be neutral and can not support watch members similar to how they would their sworn officers.

    This in combination with the state of race relations and a media only interested in headlights makes neighborhood watch participation a fool’s endeavor.

  14. jack76590,

    You may be right about neighborhood watch associations. But I can’t help thinking about Curtis Sliwa and his Guardian Angels group. He started them in 1979 in NYC. They are an example of a successful neighborhood watch group with chapters in cities around the world.

    It’s true they are not allowed to carry guns, but, if I am not mistaken, they travel in groups. What if George had had an armed partner with him that night? Would Trayvon have attacked two crackers?

    I guess the “what ifs?” can go on endlessly. It was the perfect storm, and these encounters seem to be not just black & white, but gray.

    About Curtis Sliwa and guns. On the radio, I once heard him say that it is good he doesn’t carry a gun, because if he did, he would use it too much. So he is pro-gun, but NYC doesn’t recognize the Second Amendment.

    When I look at intent, I can tell good from evil. George was a good guy with a gun. His intent was to protect his neighborhood from Billy Badass. Trayvon was a criminal who wanted to beat on that “creepy ass cracka.” Justice was served.

    Did George do everything perfectly? Of course not. But shooting just one bullet shows at least some restraint, especially after being beaten.

    If George had been a police officer, would he have emptied the magazine into Trayvon? Probably, and that would be OK too. We don’t know what might have been, but Trayvon could have become a revolving door career criminal.

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